This is very similar to last week with that mind reading startup thing. Please read the paper before commenting.
This is a tool to help researchers in figuring out what different parts of the brain are actually for with less experimenter bias contamination of “well we think maybe it’s about this so let’s show it video of x to see”.
The essence runs on having someone sit in a scanner for a couple hours watching all sorts of things, and then feeding that to a model that will then build its own representation of said data and try different things on it until it’s found what makes a certain part sing in the model.
The purpose is a generalized understanding of brain function, more or less the same way we’ve been doing it all these years. Expose brain to something, record it somehow, see if brains reaction in the recording helps you understand more about who we are and what cognition is.
Also: one of the V3A animations reminds me loosely of things I saw when I was a kid, at night, shortly before I slept (though my experience then was more circular).
Isn't there that one Harry Potter warning. I think it was the potion guy who said too much luck is dangerous. I guess that is somewhat of a parallel to this. Too much positive visual stimuli is dangerous or bad.
My understanding is that those who work with the mentally handicapped use bright lights and other stimuli to soothe and control them. It is also my understanding that the autistic are stimulated by vibrant colors (coughcoughMy Little Ponycoughcough).
Who is to say that the rest of us are not also vulnerable to such controlling stimuli?
Very interesting. We have an organic experiment converging to maximum stimulation in short form videos (which will become the majority of training data for future video gen models) Already approaching the capabilities of a “mood organ” from blade runner. Except usually most people don’t even make the choice to change their mood anymore.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Do_Androids_Dream_of_Electric_...
This is already happening at scale by the social media feed algorithms. We don't need generated content to accomplish this. In a sea of user created content, plenty of it is already at peak activation.
Apart from ethically bad and evil use cases of this application, can we use it to massage the parts of brain like we do it to our bones and muscles with the help of physiotherapists?
reason I am asking it could be some relief to our brains after tedious working day, especially after heavy AI usage
This does indeed seem comically evil. While surely this may provide somewhat interesting insights in how our brain processes things, this seems squarely past the "should" part of "you scientists were so obsessed with whether you could you failed to consider whether you should"
And I have yet to see a single paper like this where a researcher bails out and publicly says they refuse to work on such projects. Not one.
The most benign interpretation of this observation is that science is filled with spineless opportunists who don’t care who they hurt with what they create. A slightly less benign interpretation might be that many of these people are doing this deliberately, and getting off on the sense of power it gives them.
In their defence, don't shoot the messenger. Just because they published it doesn't mean that others haven't already discovered it. Better to know its possible than be completely ignorant.
I'd say we're already well past that point. Short-form "content" already exists and is messing with people's brains, this is the same thing just taken a few steps further. By the time the tech companies start using it, it will already be too late and we'll be left discussing whether the next man-made nightmare they come up with is the point where the tech industry must be stopped.
I wonder if the end-game of this field of research will be to run these simulations at scale using neuron-on-a-chip services such as [0] Cortical Cloud.
Will be interesting to see how strong the controlling forces can be - enough to make you miss things in direct perception like in the book, or only softer effects further up the cognition layer stack
"Prime Intellect, I would like you to begin stimulating the neurons of the pleasure center of my brain, one at a time, and remember the ones I report to you as being favorable."
My current theory is that these are similar to cigarettes. Nobody likes the first draft, it burns your lungs, your entire body wants to reject it. But the nicotine stimulates just the right receptors so that if you keep at it for just long enough, you'll be hooked and start disregarding the terrible taste, smell, tar in your lungs, and yellowing of your teeth.
All of this to say, if you subjected yourself to just enough TikTok scrolling on just the right topic, you might find yourself using it occasionally after that initial hump, then slightly more frequently, then daily.
You might still not "like" it, but the habit is what matters.
I hope my brain is also different. I also have never spent hours scrolling through short-form videos on Instagram, TikTok, Facebok, etc. I never ever walk outside with my phone in my hand, instead enjoying the view.
I do enjoy watching YouTube videos at home, on the living-room flatscreen, on a variety of topics, but I select them manually, one at a time, from the vast selection The Algorithm(TM) offers me, plus my own searches.
If you read the techbique it reads like something far less remarkable being PR’d to sound like a big deal.
The fact it’s bucketing by making images of lighting and facial expressions, the fact it doesn’t natively do the video it does an image then video generates from it.
The results look really bad and samey. Doubt this would work for the actual thing they’re pitching it for.
[delayed]
This is very similar to last week with that mind reading startup thing. Please read the paper before commenting.
This is a tool to help researchers in figuring out what different parts of the brain are actually for with less experimenter bias contamination of “well we think maybe it’s about this so let’s show it video of x to see”.
The essence runs on having someone sit in a scanner for a couple hours watching all sorts of things, and then feeding that to a model that will then build its own representation of said data and try different things on it until it’s found what makes a certain part sing in the model.
The purpose is a generalized understanding of brain function, more or less the same way we’ve been doing it all these years. Expose brain to something, record it somehow, see if brains reaction in the recording helps you understand more about who we are and what cognition is.
As others on Telegram have said: automated search for visual superstimuli likely leads to bad outcomes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supernormal_stimulus
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BLIT_(short_story)
Also: one of the V3A animations reminds me loosely of things I saw when I was a kid, at night, shortly before I slept (though my experience then was more circular).
On telegram?
Isn't there that one Harry Potter warning. I think it was the potion guy who said too much luck is dangerous. I guess that is somewhat of a parallel to this. Too much positive visual stimuli is dangerous or bad.
Others on Telegram? Some sort of a HN channel?
Or as SCP calls them, cognitohazards.
Also relevant: <https://www.quantamagazine.org/a-math-theory-for-why-people-...>
My understanding is that those who work with the mentally handicapped use bright lights and other stimuli to soothe and control them. It is also my understanding that the autistic are stimulated by vibrant colors (coughcoughMy Little Ponycoughcough).
Who is to say that the rest of us are not also vulnerable to such controlling stimuli?
Bright lights in particular, I'm thinking: yes, normal people do find sunbathing relaxing.
Very interesting. We have an organic experiment converging to maximum stimulation in short form videos (which will become the majority of training data for future video gen models) Already approaching the capabilities of a “mood organ” from blade runner. Except usually most people don’t even make the choice to change their mood anymore. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Do_Androids_Dream_of_Electric_...
This is already happening at scale by the social media feed algorithms. We don't need generated content to accomplish this. In a sea of user created content, plenty of it is already at peak activation.
The plan is to get content producers out of the loop to reduce revenue share and boost profits.
Apart from ethically bad and evil use cases of this application, can we use it to massage the parts of brain like we do it to our bones and muscles with the help of physiotherapists?
reason I am asking it could be some relief to our brains after tedious working day, especially after heavy AI usage
Its also an interesting way to discover what that part of the brain is for, right.
We are really getting to the point where the tech industry must be stopped if humanity is to continue at all, let alone thrive.
This does indeed seem comically evil. While surely this may provide somewhat interesting insights in how our brain processes things, this seems squarely past the "should" part of "you scientists were so obsessed with whether you could you failed to consider whether you should"
> This does indeed seem comically evil.
And I have yet to see a single paper like this where a researcher bails out and publicly says they refuse to work on such projects. Not one.
The most benign interpretation of this observation is that science is filled with spineless opportunists who don’t care who they hurt with what they create. A slightly less benign interpretation might be that many of these people are doing this deliberately, and getting off on the sense of power it gives them.
In their defence, don't shoot the messenger. Just because they published it doesn't mean that others haven't already discovered it. Better to know its possible than be completely ignorant.
Then maybe publish the results, but don't publish the "how to".
Would it be better if this was done on monkeys? Because people did that before this in silico digital brain stuff.
These aren't scientists. They are techbros. That's why it comes out like this.
I'd say we're already well past that point. Short-form "content" already exists and is messing with people's brains, this is the same thing just taken a few steps further. By the time the tech companies start using it, it will already be too late and we'll be left discussing whether the next man-made nightmare they come up with is the point where the tech industry must be stopped.
I get that people see this and think: ads and social media. My first thought was cognitive neurorehabilitation and brain stimulation.
Realistically, probably ads, but maybe not only that?
(AI start-up idea: one of our ads a day keeps dementia away! /s)
You can't say things like this on this website. On here, every new tech thing is a "progress" /s
Progress, but towards what?
Ads efficacy, of course.
Think of the shareholders and Capital. Money matters more than human, commie. /s
I wonder if the end-game of this field of research will be to run these simulations at scale using neuron-on-a-chip services such as [0] Cortical Cloud.
I don't think it's a matter of if but when. Grim.
[0] https://corticallabs.com/cloud
What are these videos supposed to do? I watched few of them and it does nothing for me?
if it is targetting visual regions of brain and I have aphantasia (I cannot visualize anything in my mind) is that connected?
Reminds me of the parrot https://www.sfsfss.com/stories2/BLIT.htm
I wonder what Meta could do with a similar technology…
But here we can start also the usual discussion about technology research for the sake of it vs calibration of possible side effects of new research
Personally i think we haven’t solve this problem and thus it’s just a matter of time until we’ll get in a non-going-back point
WOW! Cant wait to tell to future generations that we had voluntarily made these algorithms to manipulate and influence our own brains
What in the zuck is this?
Wait, this is with a digital twin only? Not fMRI or webcam based?
How can one work on that and not consider that they're pure evil?
Think of the shareholders (it's time to start using physical force to stop people)
I can't wait until I see AI-generated gambling ads that are specifically created to stimulate my brain the most
Straight out of Echopraxia.
Will be interesting to see how strong the controlling forces can be - enough to make you miss things in direct perception like in the book, or only softer effects further up the cognition layer stack
That's fascinating. I wish the demo videos were longer.
Am I the only one who is avoiding even clicking the link just in case?
No, you are not alone.
"Prime Intellect, I would like you to begin stimulating the neurons of the pleasure center of my brain, one at a time, and remember the ones I report to you as being favorable."
My brain never liked vertical video, shortform content and AI slop.
Is my brain different or am I just a grumpy millenial hipster?
My current theory is that these are similar to cigarettes. Nobody likes the first draft, it burns your lungs, your entire body wants to reject it. But the nicotine stimulates just the right receptors so that if you keep at it for just long enough, you'll be hooked and start disregarding the terrible taste, smell, tar in your lungs, and yellowing of your teeth.
All of this to say, if you subjected yourself to just enough TikTok scrolling on just the right topic, you might find yourself using it occasionally after that initial hump, then slightly more frequently, then daily.
You might still not "like" it, but the habit is what matters.
You're not alone!
I hope my brain is also different. I also have never spent hours scrolling through short-form videos on Instagram, TikTok, Facebok, etc. I never ever walk outside with my phone in my hand, instead enjoying the view.
I do enjoy watching YouTube videos at home, on the living-room flatscreen, on a variety of topics, but I select them manually, one at a time, from the vast selection The Algorithm(TM) offers me, plus my own searches.
these videos were disappointing and underwhelming
If you read the techbique it reads like something far less remarkable being PR’d to sound like a big deal.
The fact it’s bucketing by making images of lighting and facial expressions, the fact it doesn’t natively do the video it does an image then video generates from it.
The results look really bad and samey. Doubt this would work for the actual thing they’re pitching it for.