My regular thing is Monday coworking at a specific cafe. It’s a great way to start the week. Sometimes there is six or seven of us. Sometimes just two. Sometimes we get dinner or drinks after or go to karaoke next door.
Another is regular coffee + sports with a friend. We are slowly meeting and playing with the other regulars there and entering small tournaments.
Still, it does require worrying about flakiness. It’s hard to get something off the ground if you can’t get enough commitment to book a table or even put it in your calendar . At some point if people want to make friends they should act like they care.
It’s really frustrating that the person already making the effort to organise things should take on the emotional toll of making everyone else’s life as noncommittal as possible.
I have exactly one friend. I had two, but one of them recently passed away suddenly. At 51, I can definitely say it's very hard to meet anyone. I guess I need to start playing D&D or board games or disc golf.
I can vouch for board games. I play DCC (D&D for grognards) and board games with a group I met through a guy at work. It was a little awkward at first, but we've been doing it every few weeks for years now.
I created (well ... bought the domain) https://clubs.fyi to solve this problem for myself, after I moved to a new city and found myself with no friends for like the 4th time in my life[1].
And yes, the findings in TFA are true. The main catalyzer is something you do regularly with another person. That's it. It could be just sitting next to each other, but weekly. The best thing for this is joining a club, clubs happen around a common interest but also a club could just be something like "we sit on this bench every week".
I got busy with work and other stuff and have not put in the care this project needs to get it off the ground, but if you're interested in helping out, feel free to reach out.
Two takeaways (not mentioned in TFA):
* Being intentional means knowing thyself and deciding what you want in your life with as much detail as you can. "I want to meet new people" is not as good as "I want to meet people who like baking muffins AND are actively engaged with it AND also want to meet other people that are heavily into muffins". Sure, the audience is greatly reduced the more specific you go, but the value of that group when you find it is 100x more rewarding. You don't need 100 friends, you only need 2 or 3 genuinely good friends :).
* A lot of people are on the same boat as you, way more than you imagine. Something like 6-7 out of 10. So, grab your hometown population, multiply it by 0.7, that's how many people are willing to make new friends TODAY. The problem is that we have been trained to suck at meeting new people, the processes by which we discover each other and learn about each other has been labeled as "exposing yourself" by nu-psychologists (of which the vast majority should be imprisoned imo, but that's a different topic).
The reason why this (fear) has been ingrained into the population is to have a mass of people who age/die faster because they are lonely and (induced to be) stupid; but again, that's a different topic, lol. I just want to give you the overall context.
A club is the perfect excuse to let those guards down, after all, you and others think "I'm not a creep[2], I'm here because I genuinely like <collecting Pokemon cards or whatever>" and those connections start to flourish naturally (because they're natural, we are primed to meet people, we are primed to make connections). So, go ahead and just join one local club that caters to your interest; if it doesn't exist, create it, it will be a very rewarding experience.
1: Everyone told me to do D&D. I don't like D&D and trying to force yourself into something you don't really like just to meet people has low ROI (I've tried it for years, I stopped doing it).
2: Thinking you are one is part of the psychological abuse that was put in there on purpose and by design. I cannot stress this enough, one must understand the causes to tackle the disease properly.
That's advice to meet activity partners, not friends. Think of your closest friends. Did you set out to meet them by looking for people with their exact interests? Maybe you did and you and your friends are part of a scene, but I'd bet most people did not.
On advice like yours, I started a niche club and ran it for 3 years. When people join your club, they're not there to meet you! They're joining to participate in the club. Now you're in the awkward position of responsibility as the club's host/organizer, with the additional distance between you and the other participants.
A healthy social life consists of having people at various degrees of familiarity, who can move up and down closeness spectrum.
You start with setting specific relationships. Your gym buddies, your work buddies, that guy who's always at the bar you go to. For most people, their longest lived friendships started as school friends, or their parents' friends' kids. IMO, most people are able to figure this type of socializing out.
The next step up in familiarity involves building a relationship that is not fixed to a particular setting. You take a setting-specific friend, and invite them to something else. The easy way is the sort of thing where the place/timing is adjacent. You go, "Hey, gym-buddy, want to grab dinner after our workout? I've heard about this new Ethopian-Italian fusion place and I've been meaning to go". Once you reach that level of repoire, you start inviting them to things that are not immediately adjacent, like "yo, ACDC is going to be in town on the 20th, want to see 'em?". IMO, this is the step people fail at. They never make the step of inviting people to shit, and then end up with a bunch of work friends that they never see again after job hopping.
Then you make sure to see them in social settings at least every other month or so, and bam, friends. Then you start introducing your friends to each other, so that you end up nucleating a friend group. That makes it much easier to plan things, because you don't need to say "when is everyone free", you just make plans and some subset of people show up. Ideally you keep this up by establishing some sort of regular gathering, where inviting your other friends is encouraged. This lets you meet your friends' friends, which will expand your social life further. Sometimes multiple friend groups will merge, which again adds a bunch of people to your 1 degree and 2 degrees of removal set.
Beyond that basic process, the only key tips are 1) alcohol helps, there's a reason it's been the social lubricant of choice since the foundation of civilization. 2) It's okay that not everybody you ever interact with ends up a close friend. Knowing people helps you get to know more people. 3) Relationships are built on mutual utility. Most friendships exist because the people involved find spending time with the others more enjoyable than spending time alone. You can tip the scales in your favor on that by being enjoyable to spend time with. You tip the scales even further by being likely to say "yes" when invited to stuff. People don't like the feeling of being rejected, so someone who will routinely be down to hang when invited will get invited to hang a lot more than someone who is more picky. Don't agree to stuff where you'll be miserable, but if the options are a quiet night at home and a mediocre night of bowling with your friends, go with the bowling.
These tips are offered often and are presumably working for someone. As someone who has followed or tried to follow them for most of my life, there are lots of ways these tips might fail to serve:
- Places you visit often might be fundamentally antisocial: e.g., a gym where everyone wears headphones.
- Tickets to popular events (AC/DC) are astronomically expensive and sell out long in advance.
- Inviting people who you don't know well to smaller, local, less spectacular events tends to bore people.
- If someone is your first local prospective friend, inviting them and only them out constantly can stress an already tenuous relationship.
- Introducing people to each other may reveal that they don't enjoy each other's company, so now they're both less interested in hanging out with your group.
- Your prospective friends might have no local friends of their own, so they depend on you disproportionately for all of their socializing.
- Your prospective friends might not drink alcohol or enjoy hanging out in bars, so hanging out at a bar no longer feels very inclusive.
- Some people have a tight budget and don't deal well with the perceived obligation to spend money when out with friends.
To be honest, I've had a hard time managing these complications. It should be dead easy to apply advice, but it's not.
My closest friends came to be because I spent significant time around them.
>The main catalyzer is something you do regularly with another person.
The easiest thing to do that in an intentional way is to find regular activities and do them with other people. The activity is the excuse to be together for x amount of time every week, be it whatever. If you choose something you genuinely like, not only will your intent be more sincere but even if you didn't meet anyone, at least you did something you enjoyed.
This is advice for people who have zero or one friends. If you already friends, then, by definition, you don't have this problem. Also, a bit controversial but useful, people who don't have this problem usually give very poor advice to people who have it. "Just make more friends, bro".
I'm curious to hear if you can think of a better way to make friends irl with a decent chance of success.
>I started a niche club and ran it for 3 years.
Did you not make one single lasting connection (friendship) from that?
> I'm curious to hear if you can think of a better way to make friends irl with a decent chance of success.
Any environment where you can meaningfully help each other: a group for new parents, a study group at school, joining a non-profit advisor board.
> Did you not make one single lasting connection (friendship) from that?
I made a lot of activity partners: people I could talk to about that topic, and maybe some adjacent topics, but who didn't have a lot of interest in making me a part of their life outside that general topic. They wouldn't join invitations for dinner, they wouldn't hang out outside the club's context, and they would eventually flake out.
As someone who has experienced the opposite effect I think the trick is to just finding passion in what you do and your hobbies. The more of a resource I am around my interests the easier it’s always been more me to make new friends with those same interests just by having something to talk about
> I was told that this person really had all the friends that they need.
In my experience, this does tend to happen in smaller communities - a small town where everyone knows each other, and already has picked out all the people they're likely to be friends with.
> Being intentional is essential, she says.
> According to Franco, the key to building a community of friends is setting up planned interactions, like regular group events or rotating potlucks.
I'm 50, I have more real friends, every year of my life. Making new friends isn't hard, you just need to make it a priority, if you don't prioritize it then it won't happen.
One of my old best friends from my 20's/30's only leaves the house to go to work, sits alone on social media circle jerk politics, never returns texts, the few times I've seen him he just complained about not having friends and it being everyone else's fault.
If you want to make more friends, leave your house, go out and volunteer somewhere. Return calls/emails/texts with the people you meet. Do the work, get more friends.
For people into music: Would you be interested in an app that lists music events in your area, where you can register yourself as going, and where people can apply to go with you?
What do you think would work well? What do you think the pitfalls might be?
Not cynically. Just, is this a hobby for someone? If so, awesome. In my town we have a WhatsApp org for local musicians that helps with gear exchange, gig promotion, collaboration, etc.
Restaurants and bars and event spaces use a myriad of promotion vehicles. Other local businesses. The paper. Official announcements from the town. Other events. Etc. Same with the groups playing.
The ways to find this stuff aren’t amazing but not so bad that I’m searching for another app on my phone.
There are multiple websites that list events in London. I have quite niche music tastes, and would pay a few quid per month for the opportunity to get in contact with people who want to go to the events I'm interested in.
London city or London and all surrounding small town areas? I’m outside NYC. Tons of apps in NYC market and I can’t imagine another. But the suburban market has fewer or none.
My point was that even as an avid music fan, I don’t hear a lot of folks looking for another app for this but maybe I am way underestimating what’s possible.
"Lists events in your area" is always the hard part.
The bars in my city don't have public APIs. If you start small and local, you could maybe get buy in from some places, "Send this address an email with event details and I will help you get butts in the door!"
Also if you build any app that lets you meet new people, especially new people with compatible interests, Match Group will buy you out and turn whatever you built into another tinder.
There is a number of centralised places for finding music events in London. None of them allow you to find people to go with. Regarding being bought out by Match: I wouldn't complain.
Stand for something more than yourself. Be curious and learn about folks you meet. I am in my 50s and have many young and old friends, including 5 new ones this year.
Honestly I have found it easy to make friends as an adult. Just need to go and do activities with other single adults and they are likely open to and have time to be friends beyond the meeting activity in my experience.
Hiking / taking extend walks, boardgames, beach volleyball, gather at a ping pong table in a local park, volunteer work, walking a dog or dogsitting, movie & book clubs, language exchanges / classes, all sorts of courses at adult education centers, social dancing events, pub crawls, run clubs, poker nights, wine tasting, dining events, single meetups, pádel tournaments, ...
It is really not that hard coming up with something.
In my experience, it just takes initiative. Think of it this way, if most people want more friends, then the odds are in your favor. It just takes a little vulnerability to bridge the social gap and make connections.
If you’re responsible and you like animals, there’s no easier way to connect with people from all walks of life than by owning a dog. Assuming you live in a fairly dog‑friendly area, it becomes much easier to break the ice and spend time in shared spaces where everyone already has at least one thing in common.
I think people should foster "regular things" in the tiny things in their life. Not huge group potlucks/etc.
If you go to lunch with a friend, ask "would you like to do this regularly?"
lunch/walk/hike/movie/dinner/gaming/sewing/driving/<your-idea-here>
weekly/every two weeks/every first saturday of the month
don't worry about flakiness
I've done this with a few people and my life has gotten better.
at first it was a little awkward, but people RESPONDED to it. Others need this too!
My regular thing is Monday coworking at a specific cafe. It’s a great way to start the week. Sometimes there is six or seven of us. Sometimes just two. Sometimes we get dinner or drinks after or go to karaoke next door.
Another is regular coffee + sports with a friend. We are slowly meeting and playing with the other regulars there and entering small tournaments.
Still, it does require worrying about flakiness. It’s hard to get something off the ground if you can’t get enough commitment to book a table or even put it in your calendar . At some point if people want to make friends they should act like they care.
It’s really frustrating that the person already making the effort to organise things should take on the emotional toll of making everyone else’s life as noncommittal as possible.
You are spot on.
Throughout school, my mates would meet up at a lookout on Wednesday @ 3-5ish PM, go grab dinner and just hang out.
Been doing this for 7 years straight. There is enough of us that someone being sick or away doesn't impact anything.
I have exactly one friend. I had two, but one of them recently passed away suddenly. At 51, I can definitely say it's very hard to meet anyone. I guess I need to start playing D&D or board games or disc golf.
I can vouch for board games. I play DCC (D&D for grognards) and board games with a group I met through a guy at work. It was a little awkward at first, but we've been doing it every few weeks for years now.
I created (well ... bought the domain) https://clubs.fyi to solve this problem for myself, after I moved to a new city and found myself with no friends for like the 4th time in my life[1].
And yes, the findings in TFA are true. The main catalyzer is something you do regularly with another person. That's it. It could be just sitting next to each other, but weekly. The best thing for this is joining a club, clubs happen around a common interest but also a club could just be something like "we sit on this bench every week".
I got busy with work and other stuff and have not put in the care this project needs to get it off the ground, but if you're interested in helping out, feel free to reach out.
Two takeaways (not mentioned in TFA):
* Being intentional means knowing thyself and deciding what you want in your life with as much detail as you can. "I want to meet new people" is not as good as "I want to meet people who like baking muffins AND are actively engaged with it AND also want to meet other people that are heavily into muffins". Sure, the audience is greatly reduced the more specific you go, but the value of that group when you find it is 100x more rewarding. You don't need 100 friends, you only need 2 or 3 genuinely good friends :).
* A lot of people are on the same boat as you, way more than you imagine. Something like 6-7 out of 10. So, grab your hometown population, multiply it by 0.7, that's how many people are willing to make new friends TODAY. The problem is that we have been trained to suck at meeting new people, the processes by which we discover each other and learn about each other has been labeled as "exposing yourself" by nu-psychologists (of which the vast majority should be imprisoned imo, but that's a different topic).
The reason why this (fear) has been ingrained into the population is to have a mass of people who age/die faster because they are lonely and (induced to be) stupid; but again, that's a different topic, lol. I just want to give you the overall context.
A club is the perfect excuse to let those guards down, after all, you and others think "I'm not a creep[2], I'm here because I genuinely like <collecting Pokemon cards or whatever>" and those connections start to flourish naturally (because they're natural, we are primed to meet people, we are primed to make connections). So, go ahead and just join one local club that caters to your interest; if it doesn't exist, create it, it will be a very rewarding experience.
1: Everyone told me to do D&D. I don't like D&D and trying to force yourself into something you don't really like just to meet people has low ROI (I've tried it for years, I stopped doing it).
2: Thinking you are one is part of the psychological abuse that was put in there on purpose and by design. I cannot stress this enough, one must understand the causes to tackle the disease properly.
That's advice to meet activity partners, not friends. Think of your closest friends. Did you set out to meet them by looking for people with their exact interests? Maybe you did and you and your friends are part of a scene, but I'd bet most people did not.
On advice like yours, I started a niche club and ran it for 3 years. When people join your club, they're not there to meet you! They're joining to participate in the club. Now you're in the awkward position of responsibility as the club's host/organizer, with the additional distance between you and the other participants.
A healthy social life consists of having people at various degrees of familiarity, who can move up and down closeness spectrum.
You start with setting specific relationships. Your gym buddies, your work buddies, that guy who's always at the bar you go to. For most people, their longest lived friendships started as school friends, or their parents' friends' kids. IMO, most people are able to figure this type of socializing out.
The next step up in familiarity involves building a relationship that is not fixed to a particular setting. You take a setting-specific friend, and invite them to something else. The easy way is the sort of thing where the place/timing is adjacent. You go, "Hey, gym-buddy, want to grab dinner after our workout? I've heard about this new Ethopian-Italian fusion place and I've been meaning to go". Once you reach that level of repoire, you start inviting them to things that are not immediately adjacent, like "yo, ACDC is going to be in town on the 20th, want to see 'em?". IMO, this is the step people fail at. They never make the step of inviting people to shit, and then end up with a bunch of work friends that they never see again after job hopping.
Then you make sure to see them in social settings at least every other month or so, and bam, friends. Then you start introducing your friends to each other, so that you end up nucleating a friend group. That makes it much easier to plan things, because you don't need to say "when is everyone free", you just make plans and some subset of people show up. Ideally you keep this up by establishing some sort of regular gathering, where inviting your other friends is encouraged. This lets you meet your friends' friends, which will expand your social life further. Sometimes multiple friend groups will merge, which again adds a bunch of people to your 1 degree and 2 degrees of removal set.
Beyond that basic process, the only key tips are 1) alcohol helps, there's a reason it's been the social lubricant of choice since the foundation of civilization. 2) It's okay that not everybody you ever interact with ends up a close friend. Knowing people helps you get to know more people. 3) Relationships are built on mutual utility. Most friendships exist because the people involved find spending time with the others more enjoyable than spending time alone. You can tip the scales in your favor on that by being enjoyable to spend time with. You tip the scales even further by being likely to say "yes" when invited to stuff. People don't like the feeling of being rejected, so someone who will routinely be down to hang when invited will get invited to hang a lot more than someone who is more picky. Don't agree to stuff where you'll be miserable, but if the options are a quiet night at home and a mediocre night of bowling with your friends, go with the bowling.
These tips are offered often and are presumably working for someone. As someone who has followed or tried to follow them for most of my life, there are lots of ways these tips might fail to serve:
To be honest, I've had a hard time managing these complications. It should be dead easy to apply advice, but it's not.My closest friends came to be because I spent significant time around them.
>The main catalyzer is something you do regularly with another person.
The easiest thing to do that in an intentional way is to find regular activities and do them with other people. The activity is the excuse to be together for x amount of time every week, be it whatever. If you choose something you genuinely like, not only will your intent be more sincere but even if you didn't meet anyone, at least you did something you enjoyed.
This is advice for people who have zero or one friends. If you already friends, then, by definition, you don't have this problem. Also, a bit controversial but useful, people who don't have this problem usually give very poor advice to people who have it. "Just make more friends, bro".
I'm curious to hear if you can think of a better way to make friends irl with a decent chance of success.
>I started a niche club and ran it for 3 years.
Did you not make one single lasting connection (friendship) from that?
> I'm curious to hear if you can think of a better way to make friends irl with a decent chance of success.
Any environment where you can meaningfully help each other: a group for new parents, a study group at school, joining a non-profit advisor board.
> Did you not make one single lasting connection (friendship) from that?
I made a lot of activity partners: people I could talk to about that topic, and maybe some adjacent topics, but who didn't have a lot of interest in making me a part of their life outside that general topic. They wouldn't join invitations for dinner, they wouldn't hang out outside the club's context, and they would eventually flake out.
As someone who has experienced the opposite effect I think the trick is to just finding passion in what you do and your hobbies. The more of a resource I am around my interests the easier it’s always been more me to make new friends with those same interests just by having something to talk about
> I was told that this person really had all the friends that they need.
In my experience, this does tend to happen in smaller communities - a small town where everyone knows each other, and already has picked out all the people they're likely to be friends with.
> Being intentional is essential, she says.
> According to Franco, the key to building a community of friends is setting up planned interactions, like regular group events or rotating potlucks.
For me, this is D&D.
for me its indoor rock climbing great community
I decided to put the goal of making friends on "Hard Mode." I quit drinking.
I never drank in public, is that hard mode too? I quit as well.
I'm 50, I have more real friends, every year of my life. Making new friends isn't hard, you just need to make it a priority, if you don't prioritize it then it won't happen.
One of my old best friends from my 20's/30's only leaves the house to go to work, sits alone on social media circle jerk politics, never returns texts, the few times I've seen him he just complained about not having friends and it being everyone else's fault.
If you want to make more friends, leave your house, go out and volunteer somewhere. Return calls/emails/texts with the people you meet. Do the work, get more friends.
It’s hard to make it a priority on top of everything else, but I agree.
I assure you I am indeed uncool.
For people into music: Would you be interested in an app that lists music events in your area, where you can register yourself as going, and where people can apply to go with you?
What do you think would work well? What do you think the pitfalls might be?
An event newsletter in my area creates a telegram group for each event they mention, so that people can meet and go together
I’m interested but then I ask: who pays?
Not cynically. Just, is this a hobby for someone? If so, awesome. In my town we have a WhatsApp org for local musicians that helps with gear exchange, gig promotion, collaboration, etc.
Restaurants and bars and event spaces use a myriad of promotion vehicles. Other local businesses. The paper. Official announcements from the town. Other events. Etc. Same with the groups playing.
The ways to find this stuff aren’t amazing but not so bad that I’m searching for another app on my phone.
There are multiple websites that list events in London. I have quite niche music tastes, and would pay a few quid per month for the opportunity to get in contact with people who want to go to the events I'm interested in.
London city or London and all surrounding small town areas? I’m outside NYC. Tons of apps in NYC market and I can’t imagine another. But the suburban market has fewer or none.
My point was that even as an avid music fan, I don’t hear a lot of folks looking for another app for this but maybe I am way underestimating what’s possible.
This exists for the electronic music scene, Radiate.
It looks like Radiate is an app-mandatory secondary ticket marketplace, I might be looking at the wrong Radiate though.
Well, that’s good to know. Thanks.
If you're in US, http://19hz.info
Yes, I'd be interested.
Little nitpick: people into music != people into live music.
"Lists events in your area" is always the hard part.
The bars in my city don't have public APIs. If you start small and local, you could maybe get buy in from some places, "Send this address an email with event details and I will help you get butts in the door!"
Also if you build any app that lets you meet new people, especially new people with compatible interests, Match Group will buy you out and turn whatever you built into another tinder.
There is a number of centralised places for finding music events in London. None of them allow you to find people to go with. Regarding being bought out by Match: I wouldn't complain.
> homohysteria
Do men (here) experience this often? Not often? I’ve not stumbled into this problem in many years. Perhaps this is an exaggerated issue.
And I’m still making male friends - not every day, but not none!
Stand for something more than yourself. Be curious and learn about folks you meet. I am in my 50s and have many young and old friends, including 5 new ones this year.
Honestly I have found it easy to make friends as an adult. Just need to go and do activities with other single adults and they are likely open to and have time to be friends beyond the meeting activity in my experience.
Such as?
Hiking / taking extend walks, boardgames, beach volleyball, gather at a ping pong table in a local park, volunteer work, walking a dog or dogsitting, movie & book clubs, language exchanges / classes, all sorts of courses at adult education centers, social dancing events, pub crawls, run clubs, poker nights, wine tasting, dining events, single meetups, pádel tournaments, ...
It is really not that hard coming up with something.
In my experience, it just takes initiative. Think of it this way, if most people want more friends, then the odds are in your favor. It just takes a little vulnerability to bridge the social gap and make connections.
Just be aware that vulnerability is not rewarded every time. People will be uninterested, busy, a poor match etc.
It can be hard on you sometimes when you are trying your best.
If you’re responsible and you like animals, there’s no easier way to connect with people from all walks of life than by owning a dog. Assuming you live in a fairly dog‑friendly area, it becomes much easier to break the ice and spend time in shared spaces where everyone already has at least one thing in common.
It's not just other dog walkers either, plenty of random folk will come up and talk to you just because you have an excellent dog.