These are all self-inflicted wounds by AirBnB. I have used AirBnB a few times in the past, but these days opt for a hotel instead if I can.
They could take user feedback seriously, but chose not to. Case in point: we booked a place in Hawaii. We (2 people) arrived the day of, tired as heck from the beach activities. Place looked fine, except for the crumbs of food in the nooks and crannies of the kitchen. No big deal. We crashed almost right away, too tired to do anything else. An hour later, my wife jumped up, claiming some insect was walking on her legs. I turned on the lights sleepily, and lo and behold, there were cockroaches on the ceiling, scurrying about (and one had fallen and landed on my wife's legs). In the middle of the night, I contacted AirBnB help. They wanted proof. So I took a video and sent it, along with photos. Finally around 2AM they agreed that we should get out of there. We packed up and left for the beach, to wait things out.
My first reaction was: I should leave a review telling people about the roaches. But guess what? AirBnB cancelled our reservation, so there was no way to rate the place or leave a review! They did refund me, but we wasted a day trying to catch up on the lost sleep.
After that experience, I stopped booking AirBnBs if I could help it. They (and VRBO) are a last resort for me (no pun intended).
It's interesting how Airbnb has diverged from its original vibe of "staying at somebody's house." When I "stay at somebody's house" I wash the dishes, take out the trash, etc. Essentially, leave it as I found it, if not a bit better. I also expect "somebody's house" to be cleaner than a hotel.
Granted, Airbnb has taken on the hotel industry, and so I'm not surprised that their rules have evolved.
You do those things when you’re staying at a friend or family member’s place. But your friends and family aren’t charging you hundreds of dollars a night, plus a $250 cleaning fee.
It’s not just Airbnb the company that moved away from it, it’s the Airbnb hosts that moved away from it as soon as opportunists started becoming mega landlords renting out ikea-furnished party houses. It hasn’t been the original “person with a spare room for a weekend” Airbnb in a long, long time.
These things are banned because they became the Amazon equivalent of low balling rates and tacking on shipping fees.
The relationship to homliness really has nothing to do with this. Your friends never charged you to stay then charge 4x that because you left some trash.
I agree about how one should conduct themselves in someone else's home, but is it really that interesting how they progressed as a technology company? To me it seems like the tried and true formula of enshittification. It's the startup playbook.
I've been an Airbnb host for the last 3 years. We've never expected guests to do any cleaning or washing of dishes (although it's always appreciated when they do!) We charge a small cleaning fee to cover the costs of cleaning our studio which only takes an hour. We also have maintained a really high rating over the last few years (currently at 4.96). I would hope that other rentals that have ridiculous rules and high cleaning fees would suffer from average ratings?
The market is more complicated than that, unfortunately. Some properties can sustain high ratings on their other strengths (e.g. location, decor, view, heritage) regardless of the host rules and the clientele that's interested in them. There's also a problem with the rental market getting very thin for some locations and property types (e.g. 3+ bedrooms), so ratings effectively stop mattering.
As a personal example, I once stayed at a place that charged a $150 cleaning fee, but also required dishes + taking the trash out and down the street, which wasn't known until we opened the door. And of course there was a threat that failure to do so would incur a fee. Also a bit of ceiling plaster fell on my wife during the night. Still had a fantastic rating because it was a castle and I'd stay there again if someone else paid.
Out of curiosity, why is the cleaning fee not included into the rental rate? Is it required to be listed separately or does that simplify accounting somehow?
Maybe to encourage longer stays? The cleaning fee is paid once per stay, not once per night. I get why it is a separate charge, since they aren't cleaning the place daily (like a hotel), only at the end of your stay.
For us, we charge the same cleaning fee whether you stay for 1 night or 7 nights. So I don't know how we can incorporate that into the nightly fee without either over-charging or under-charging for cleaning. Having it listed separately keeps it consistent and clear to guests.
Not only that, a cleaning crew that I'm explicitly paying for via the cleaning fee. It was ridiculous, and I'm sure it drove a lot of people to choose hotels over an equivalent Airbnb.
Same. I have consistently left feedback that even the idea of such policies makes me choose airbnb less. Haven’t used them in several years now due to the possibility.
Contrarian view here but honestly I can't imagine not cleaning up after yourself by default. Of course I am not saying that I do a deep clean at every place I stay but if I'm staying in an AirBNB the very least I do is to leave the place in a civilised way. For example, if I use kitchen utensils I either clean them or put in the dishwasher when available. I seriously never understood people that just leave completely dirty things behind, especially when they are travelling with their kids.
I would never be expected to clean my dishes after ordering room service in a hotel. The price of an AirBNB would have to be much cheaper than a hotel in order for me to do my own cleaning. And in my city at least, it never was.
I can see both sides of the issue, that is, hosts protecting themselves (to an extent) from dirty guests. I've seen once the huge pile of dishes in a shared stay, and it wasn't nice.
I think it's not a big issue for people who clean up after themselves daily, but on the other hand, sparing those last 10 minutes on the checkout morning... ;)
You can still do that. The host just can't require you to do that - especially after charging a mandatory cleaning fee.
I mostly stopped using AirBnB due to the impact of their existence and lobbying on cities and affordable housing, but after my final few stays I was ready to quit over the huge fees, the fact those fees were hidden when searching, and the absurd rules BS.
I've never been a host but I can't see why this would be a problem that AirBnB should make a call on. I've travelled to places where they have different social norms and visitors should adapt to local culture.
Oddly this will probably let prices be raised, even though there's a cleaner usually there right after..
Most guests of AirBNB like clean homes, and usually tidy up pretty well themselves. Maybe there's a way to incentivize those who choose to, or want to and offer a discount if they want it.
They were making guests wash dishes? That would've been a real problem.
My maid service will not wash dishes. They need me to clear the sink every time before they arrive. It's often a point of contention, because I leave dirty dishes quite often, and I simply forget what needs to be done. I don't have a problem with doing it for them, I just forget.
But I believe that the reason they will not wash my dishes is because of food safety. In a commercial kitchen, even the dishwasher needs to hold a Food Handler's card or certificate. The sanitizing of dishes and utensils is serious business. If they're not clean enough to eat from, you could be passing foodborne illness.
I would never want to stay at a place that didn't professionally wash its dishes. I've never stayed with AirBNB and I plan to keep it that way. Thankfully, the hotel industry is still a quite viable business, and hotels have staff, insurance, and regulation on their side, even now. I recently had a "staycation" in a 98-year-old classic hotel, and it was so wonderful, worry-free, and pleasant, and cost-effective. I am thankful that they are still operating like that.
AirBnb is camping. I have been travel camping with and without people for 50 years. The longer you camp the better the experience. Almost all of the first 25 years involved a tent (or bivy sack), and maybe a camp kitchen. Then you surface again, happy minded, into a world where people travel but they expect everyone touching their utensils or even maybe food(?) have a "Food Handler's card or certificate". Whatever that is. Back into the bush.
A maid service does not require a Food Handler's card to wash dishes. They won't do it by default because they can charge more if they offer it as an addon.
They literally will not do it at all. They refuse, and they will make me pick up the dishes and move them out of the sink.
Yes, if it were an add-on service, they would ask me for permission and then go ahead and charge me for the service. That is something they do with cleaning the oven and such other things. They simply will not wash dishes at all, period, full stop.
It's got to the point now, where if I forgot and left dishes in the sink, I will take them out and hide them somewhere, like the fridge, before the team arrives at my door. And then, hopefully I do not forget to retrieve them and properly clean them immediately.
When I rent a shore house for a week on the east coast (direct from owner rental, not Airbnb), it’s been customary for at least 30 years to clean the house and wash the dishes you use for the next people. We would usually wash them anyway when we arrived because I’m crazy.
When we had little kids we used disposable plates because we didn’t want to break the plates in the house. I don’t do Airbnb but disposable plates might be one way if you needed to stay in a short term rental.
I think that AirBnB just feels much more annoying because of the fee structures. Yes, renting private homes at a lake cabin, shore house, timeshare or ski lodge have their own customs. AirBnB feels much worse (to me) because you select $200 a night, and end up paying $400 after all of the fees. So it used to make it difficult to search for places in your price range because of all the absurd fees piled on top most of which is cleaning. Then you have to clean yourself via a list of chores they give you, then you could be fined by them. All the while a massive corporation makes a ton of money simply matchmaking. It is much different when you are paying it forward in a small community. I didn't articulate it well, but for me the feeling is entirely different. Less that you participate in a community and culture and more that you are disposable labor for what is increasingly a luxury experience typically provided by a rich landlord.
Oh yeah. I toss the sheets in the washer the moment I get up on the day I'm leaving, and transfer them to the dryer (or clothesline) on my way out the door. So there's no chance of the cleaning crew "cleaning" the bed by just making it. As a favor to the next renter.
These are all self-inflicted wounds by AirBnB. I have used AirBnB a few times in the past, but these days opt for a hotel instead if I can.
They could take user feedback seriously, but chose not to. Case in point: we booked a place in Hawaii. We (2 people) arrived the day of, tired as heck from the beach activities. Place looked fine, except for the crumbs of food in the nooks and crannies of the kitchen. No big deal. We crashed almost right away, too tired to do anything else. An hour later, my wife jumped up, claiming some insect was walking on her legs. I turned on the lights sleepily, and lo and behold, there were cockroaches on the ceiling, scurrying about (and one had fallen and landed on my wife's legs). In the middle of the night, I contacted AirBnB help. They wanted proof. So I took a video and sent it, along with photos. Finally around 2AM they agreed that we should get out of there. We packed up and left for the beach, to wait things out.
My first reaction was: I should leave a review telling people about the roaches. But guess what? AirBnB cancelled our reservation, so there was no way to rate the place or leave a review! They did refund me, but we wasted a day trying to catch up on the lost sleep.
After that experience, I stopped booking AirBnBs if I could help it. They (and VRBO) are a last resort for me (no pun intended).
I stopped using AirBnB altogether because of the rediculous cleaning rules and fees. Probably not going back but at least they're addressing it.
Market share has been falling, quick, listen to what the customers have been saying for a decade!
There’s also been documented cases of owners using AI edited images to claim guests damage. Airbnb has a systemic cultural issue.
It's interesting how Airbnb has diverged from its original vibe of "staying at somebody's house." When I "stay at somebody's house" I wash the dishes, take out the trash, etc. Essentially, leave it as I found it, if not a bit better. I also expect "somebody's house" to be cleaner than a hotel.
Granted, Airbnb has taken on the hotel industry, and so I'm not surprised that their rules have evolved.
You do those things when you’re staying at a friend or family member’s place. But your friends and family aren’t charging you hundreds of dollars a night, plus a $250 cleaning fee.
It’s not just Airbnb the company that moved away from it, it’s the Airbnb hosts that moved away from it as soon as opportunists started becoming mega landlords renting out ikea-furnished party houses. It hasn’t been the original “person with a spare room for a weekend” Airbnb in a long, long time.
You went by a "vibe" they wanted you to believe instead of the fact that you pay hotel rates to stay at these houses?
These things are banned because they became the Amazon equivalent of low balling rates and tacking on shipping fees.
The relationship to homliness really has nothing to do with this. Your friends never charged you to stay then charge 4x that because you left some trash.
I agree about how one should conduct themselves in someone else's home, but is it really that interesting how they progressed as a technology company? To me it seems like the tried and true formula of enshittification. It's the startup playbook.
I've been an Airbnb host for the last 3 years. We've never expected guests to do any cleaning or washing of dishes (although it's always appreciated when they do!) We charge a small cleaning fee to cover the costs of cleaning our studio which only takes an hour. We also have maintained a really high rating over the last few years (currently at 4.96). I would hope that other rentals that have ridiculous rules and high cleaning fees would suffer from average ratings?
The market is more complicated than that, unfortunately. Some properties can sustain high ratings on their other strengths (e.g. location, decor, view, heritage) regardless of the host rules and the clientele that's interested in them. There's also a problem with the rental market getting very thin for some locations and property types (e.g. 3+ bedrooms), so ratings effectively stop mattering.
As a personal example, I once stayed at a place that charged a $150 cleaning fee, but also required dishes + taking the trash out and down the street, which wasn't known until we opened the door. And of course there was a threat that failure to do so would incur a fee. Also a bit of ceiling plaster fell on my wife during the night. Still had a fantastic rating because it was a castle and I'd stay there again if someone else paid.
Out of curiosity, why is the cleaning fee not included into the rental rate? Is it required to be listed separately or does that simplify accounting somehow?
Maybe to encourage longer stays? The cleaning fee is paid once per stay, not once per night. I get why it is a separate charge, since they aren't cleaning the place daily (like a hotel), only at the end of your stay.
For us, we charge the same cleaning fee whether you stay for 1 night or 7 nights. So I don't know how we can incorporate that into the nightly fee without either over-charging or under-charging for cleaning. Having it listed separately keeps it consistent and clear to guests.
It is a dark pattern causing the advertised rate to be lower so the listing will get included in more filters etc.
[edit] I checked and they changed this in April of 2025, as of then the fee is rolled up in the advertised rate.
Because this way they can lie to you and offer low rates to pull you in until you go to check out.
Airbnb includes the cleaning fee (and other fees) in the advertised price. I just checked our own listing and it shows the total cost.
Thank god.
Call me lazy but I’ve always wondered why I need to take out the trash when a cleaning crew was coming in 10 minutes after I checked out.
Not only that, a cleaning crew that I'm explicitly paying for via the cleaning fee. It was ridiculous, and I'm sure it drove a lot of people to choose hotels over an equivalent Airbnb.
Same. I have consistently left feedback that even the idea of such policies makes me choose airbnb less. Haven’t used them in several years now due to the possibility.
Contrarian view here but honestly I can't imagine not cleaning up after yourself by default. Of course I am not saying that I do a deep clean at every place I stay but if I'm staying in an AirBNB the very least I do is to leave the place in a civilised way. For example, if I use kitchen utensils I either clean them or put in the dishwasher when available. I seriously never understood people that just leave completely dirty things behind, especially when they are travelling with their kids.
I would never be expected to clean my dishes after ordering room service in a hotel. The price of an AirBNB would have to be much cheaper than a hotel in order for me to do my own cleaning. And in my city at least, it never was.
I can see both sides of the issue, that is, hosts protecting themselves (to an extent) from dirty guests. I've seen once the huge pile of dishes in a shared stay, and it wasn't nice.
I think it's not a big issue for people who clean up after themselves daily, but on the other hand, sparing those last 10 minutes on the checkout morning... ;)
You can still do that. The host just can't require you to do that - especially after charging a mandatory cleaning fee.
I mostly stopped using AirBnB due to the impact of their existence and lobbying on cities and affordable housing, but after my final few stays I was ready to quit over the huge fees, the fact those fees were hidden when searching, and the absurd rules BS.
From AirBNB https://www.airbnb.com/help/article/4168 (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50188512)
I've never been a host but I can't see why this would be a problem that AirBnB should make a call on. I've travelled to places where they have different social norms and visitors should adapt to local culture.
Oddly this will probably let prices be raised, even though there's a cleaner usually there right after..
Most guests of AirBNB like clean homes, and usually tidy up pretty well themselves. Maybe there's a way to incentivize those who choose to, or want to and offer a discount if they want it.
https://archive.is/SLOVG
They were making guests wash dishes? That would've been a real problem.
My maid service will not wash dishes. They need me to clear the sink every time before they arrive. It's often a point of contention, because I leave dirty dishes quite often, and I simply forget what needs to be done. I don't have a problem with doing it for them, I just forget.
But I believe that the reason they will not wash my dishes is because of food safety. In a commercial kitchen, even the dishwasher needs to hold a Food Handler's card or certificate. The sanitizing of dishes and utensils is serious business. If they're not clean enough to eat from, you could be passing foodborne illness.
I would never want to stay at a place that didn't professionally wash its dishes. I've never stayed with AirBNB and I plan to keep it that way. Thankfully, the hotel industry is still a quite viable business, and hotels have staff, insurance, and regulation on their side, even now. I recently had a "staycation" in a 98-year-old classic hotel, and it was so wonderful, worry-free, and pleasant, and cost-effective. I am thankful that they are still operating like that.
AirBnb is camping. I have been travel camping with and without people for 50 years. The longer you camp the better the experience. Almost all of the first 25 years involved a tent (or bivy sack), and maybe a camp kitchen. Then you surface again, happy minded, into a world where people travel but they expect everyone touching their utensils or even maybe food(?) have a "Food Handler's card or certificate". Whatever that is. Back into the bush.
A maid service does not require a Food Handler's card to wash dishes. They won't do it by default because they can charge more if they offer it as an addon.
They literally will not do it at all. They refuse, and they will make me pick up the dishes and move them out of the sink.
Yes, if it were an add-on service, they would ask me for permission and then go ahead and charge me for the service. That is something they do with cleaning the oven and such other things. They simply will not wash dishes at all, period, full stop.
It's got to the point now, where if I forgot and left dishes in the sink, I will take them out and hide them somewhere, like the fridge, before the team arrives at my door. And then, hopefully I do not forget to retrieve them and properly clean them immediately.
I don't doubt the effect! I just wanted to point out that a domestic cleaning service does not require a license to do the dishes.
And in fact I have yet to find a maid service that doesn't offer the service. But maybe it depends on state law.
When I rent a shore house for a week on the east coast (direct from owner rental, not Airbnb), it’s been customary for at least 30 years to clean the house and wash the dishes you use for the next people. We would usually wash them anyway when we arrived because I’m crazy.
When we had little kids we used disposable plates because we didn’t want to break the plates in the house. I don’t do Airbnb but disposable plates might be one way if you needed to stay in a short term rental.
I think that AirBnB just feels much more annoying because of the fee structures. Yes, renting private homes at a lake cabin, shore house, timeshare or ski lodge have their own customs. AirBnB feels much worse (to me) because you select $200 a night, and end up paying $400 after all of the fees. So it used to make it difficult to search for places in your price range because of all the absurd fees piled on top most of which is cleaning. Then you have to clean yourself via a list of chores they give you, then you could be fined by them. All the while a massive corporation makes a ton of money simply matchmaking. It is much different when you are paying it forward in a small community. I didn't articulate it well, but for me the feeling is entirely different. Less that you participate in a community and culture and more that you are disposable labor for what is increasingly a luxury experience typically provided by a rich landlord.
For the last 30 years were they charging a mandatory $150 cleaning fee, even if you're only staying 1 night?
AFAIK, the cleaning fee is determined by the host. They can charge whatever they want.
> We would usually wash them anyway when we arrived because I’m crazy.
We wash the dishes (and sheets, if there is a dryer) when we arrive, and descale the electric kettle and the coffee machine. I guess I'm crazy too.
Oh yeah. I toss the sheets in the washer the moment I get up on the day I'm leaving, and transfer them to the dryer (or clothesline) on my way out the door. So there's no chance of the cleaning crew "cleaning" the bed by just making it. As a favor to the next renter.