Claim by 'Richard Leopold' (utterly unknown, no link) and an obviously AI generated image to make a claim that is clearly arranged for maximum anger about EU support for Ukraine.
Poster also tends to refer to Ukraine as 'The Ukraine':
Most of my posts are not remotely about this subject.
I'm also a native English speaker (albeit with a strong accent) and some ?Dutch guy is telling me how to speak it. Good grief...
This is what is on his profile:
"And please don't even think of approaching me to get your stuff posted or upvoted, if you want something posted do it yourself, if you want stuff to be upvoted post interesting stuff!
"If you comment and I'm not responding to you it may well be that you are filtered out from my view, besides I don't owe you a response."
Sure, maybe. Also we have shit roads, cold winters and there is too much fat and meat in the diet. What does it have to do with anything and how what you say is helpful?
That country's problem as I just said is that it is run by robber barons. As is Russia.
It shouldn't be ruled by a sockpuppet of Russia or the West. (Oh look, I just used the definite article and a capital letter. Nooo!) Neither of those options are independence. Maybe your mates at Central casting don't agree.
My point earlier sticks. You are not a native speaker of English and have the cheek to tell me my English is wrong, "Jacques".
I'm sorry I'm not into your military industrial complex. Unlike some people, I don't get money to plug it. I also don't support corruption anywhere ... Putin or Zelensky's government. I'm sure your support of self-determination is limited to select choices in line with the current thing. Probably not my country or Catalonia (where police etc were used to beat up voters but it wasn't fashionable for foreigners to speak up about that), just whatever suits the party line.
Ukraine has strong support across the globe and here on HN. It may be helpful if you to remember we are approaching the US midterms (among others), winter is coming to Ukraine with more Russian bombs than snow, and we seeing increased Russian propaganda and misinformation campaigns (over time). When you make statements that mirror theirs - you will get pushback, resentment, and hostility.
I get exposed to far more western propaganda here, mate. Russia Today is banned (at least on TV.) NATO all the way. One of my best friends watches this stuff most of the day. There is plenty of misinformation in there too... Like that the war is about to end. I've been hearing that for at least four or five years, but it's ground on every since. (I'm sure Moscow puts out similar crap "victory is ours" etc.) Except it hasn't.
The real beneficiaries here are arms dealers and military leaders. They're doing a roaring trade while thousands of people die. War makes money. There are obviously some people benefitting from this attrition otherwise it would have gone to proper talks and negotiations.
I don't have any interest in American mid terms. Only two parties are allowed to win. We're not all Americans in this world (or Russian spies, extraterrestrials in meat suits or active Freemasons.)
Our politicians and western media sources repeat Russian propaganda. It's all over social media. Everyone is exposed to it. I don't doubt American propaganda is wide spread across the world as well, but American propaganda is in part repeated Russian propaganda (like our current administration is fond of doing). There are even accusations / possible whistleblowing that it is actually the US Military masquerading as Russian propaganda and misinformation spreaders.
I'm trying to less divide the world by country or similar, and divide it more by Oligarchy and The People. The vast majority of us have the same needs, dreams, and desires. The Oligarchy and media (they largely control) seek to divide us.
You seem intent on being argumentative, in considering your collection of comments under this flagged post, so I'm checking out of this thread. I hope you do the same.
So you're ?Dutch and telling me how to speak English?
Two can play at this nonsense. You don't live far from Brussels do you, ya rocket? What is headquartered there? (Clue: I'm not referring to the European Union.)
Guess what? I support Ukrainian and Irish independence, just like I support Scottish, Catalan, Tibetan and the independence of currently stateless nations. I think the break up of the USSR was a good thing but that many of its successor governments are corrupt.
I guess you didn't spot that at your desk in Brussels.
No idea what "ninja editing" is, but perhaps you know what "snitch jacketing" is? That's when you start making insinuations about people because you disagree with them. Almost as pathetic as accusing them of being bots.
"Ninja editing" is when you post something here, then come back (within the two hour edit window) and change what it says, without marking it "[Edit: <changes here>]" or something similar.
Who cares? Well, if someone is trying to reply to you, you can make their reply look like a lie or off topic (whether deliberately or not).
This gives you a problem if you decide that you overstated your case, or that you were too harsh. Do you edit in a way that removes what you said that was too harsh or too strong, or do you leave it, thereby leaving what is going to trigger hostile responses? The best way to do it might be to remove it, and add "[Edit: Removed inflammatory language.]" or something similar.
"Yet the English-speaking media can't quite agree on how one of the two co-hosts should be described. It is "the Ukraine" in the UK's Daily Mirror, external, and simply "Ukraine" in the Times of India, external. Why the confusion?"
It goes on to say that the Ukrainian government doesn't like it. But since neither Ukrainian nor Russian use definite articles, it makes no odds and is not offensive.
I still say "the Czech Republic" or "the Basque Country". (I don't say "Czechia".) I know people who used to talk about "the Argentine". Apparently a Dutch person (if he is Dutch) seems to think I can't speak English.
That's a pretty selective quote, the article actually goes in to this in much further detail, which you conveniently left out:
"The Ukraine" is incorrect both grammatically and politically, says Oksana Kyzyma of the Embassy of Ukraine in London.
"Ukraine is both the conventional short and long name of the country," she says. "This name is stated in the Ukrainian Declaration of Independence and Constitution."
The use of the article relates to the time before independence in 1991, when Ukraine was a republic of the Soviet Union known as the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic, she says. Since then, it should be merely Ukraine.
There is no definite article in the Ukrainian or Russian languages and there is another theory why it crept into the English language.
Those who called it "the Ukraine" in English must have known that the word meant "borderland", says Anatoly Liberman, a professor at the University of Minnesota with a specialism in etymology. So they referred to it as "the borderland".
"After the collapse of the Soviet Union, Ukrainians probably decided that the article denigrated their country [by identifying it as a part of Russia] and abolished 'the' while speaking English, so now it is simply Ukraine.
"That's why the Ukraine suddenly lost its article in the last 20 years, it's a sort of linguistic independence in Europe, it's hugely symbolic."
"That's a pretty selective quote, the article actually goes in to this in much further detail, which you conveniently left out"
Which I mentioned, if you bothered to read it or not. But since you like making false accusations about people and playing mind games, you decided to ignore that. (You use the exact same tactic elsewhere.)
Since neither Ukrainian nor Russian use articles, it is all moot. It is not an issue. We talk about "the Borders" (a region here), "the Highlands" etc in Scotland and that has nothing at all to do with which way we think this country should go.
There was a seventies football song here, "We're on the march wi' Ally's Army/ We're going tae the Argentine"
According to your logic that means that saying "the Argentine" means that it is "identifying it as part of the Spanish Empire". How about "the USA"? Does that definite article mean that it should be ruled from London? Or the United Arab Emirates?
What about "the Netherlands"? The Dutch have been ruled by three empires I can think of. That argument holds no water.
It is a non-issue which some Dutch rando decides to bring up.. Oh that was you wasn't it?
sounds like more than just you need to update how they refer to other humans and cultures, it's not hard to be respectful to them... over your arguing here
Try looking at Romance languages, they attach articles to many countries and that is not disrespectful either. Celtic languages do it too. Are you going to complain about that?
Most Slavic languages do not have articles.
Do you or your friends refer to the UK as England? I bet you do. That's worse.
What I think we are doing here is Chapter 16 in Timothy Miller's book On Tyranny
16. Learn from peers in other countries
Keep up your friendships abroad, or make new friends in
other countries. The present difficulties in the United
States are an element of a larger trend. And no country is
going to find a solution by itself. Make sure you and your
family have passports.
contains false sentences despite careful wording https://mythdetector.com/en/europe-in-bentley-sales/
Underground parking is available and a car is an asset that's easy to move.
Why is this on HN? Obvious ragebait and not tech-related.
Claim by 'Richard Leopold' (utterly unknown, no link) and an obviously AI generated image to make a claim that is clearly arranged for maximum anger about EU support for Ukraine.
Poster also tends to refer to Ukraine as 'The Ukraine':
https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu...
thanks for pointing this out!
Most of my posts are not remotely about this subject.
I'm also a native English speaker (albeit with a strong accent) and some ?Dutch guy is telling me how to speak it. Good grief...
This is what is on his profile: "And please don't even think of approaching me to get your stuff posted or upvoted, if you want something posted do it yourself, if you want stuff to be upvoted post interesting stuff!
"If you comment and I'm not responding to you it may well be that you are filtered out from my view, besides I don't owe you a response."
Passive aggressive doesn't cover it.
Yep, more info:
https://mythdetector.com/en/europe-in-bentley-sales/
Ooh, how sinister. I am Scottish and "The Ukraine" is normal English. As is "the Argentine" (if you are older.)
What next? Are you going to complain I don't spell Turkey "Türkiye"?
The fuck it is. It's normal in circles that lap up Russian propaganda though, I'll give you that.
And I know you're Scottish, or at least living in Scotland. And you can stop ninja editing your comments.
Neither Russian nor Ukrainian use the definite article. As I expect you know.
Awa an bile yer heid min.
There is a centuries old holywar on this subject that you are not a party of. Just don't
I support Ukrainian independence.
That said most Soviet successor states (including Russia) are run by robber barons.
Sure, maybe. Also we have shit roads, cold winters and there is too much fat and meat in the diet. What does it have to do with anything and how what you say is helpful?
> I support Ukrainian independence.
Then you're going to have to explain what your goal was by posting this particular, clearly false link.
That country's problem as I just said is that it is run by robber barons. As is Russia.
It shouldn't be ruled by a sockpuppet of Russia or the West. (Oh look, I just used the definite article and a capital letter. Nooo!) Neither of those options are independence. Maybe your mates at Central casting don't agree.
So you did not answer the question. Ok.
Yes, I did. Robber barons.
My point earlier sticks. You are not a native speaker of English and have the cheek to tell me my English is wrong, "Jacques".
I'm sorry I'm not into your military industrial complex. Unlike some people, I don't get money to plug it. I also don't support corruption anywhere ... Putin or Zelensky's government. I'm sure your support of self-determination is limited to select choices in line with the current thing. Probably not my country or Catalonia (where police etc were used to beat up voters but it wasn't fashionable for foreigners to speak up about that), just whatever suits the party line.
Aiblins ye hinna bilt yer heid bit ye shuddae.
The biggest robber barons are in America, they dwarf all others combined
I've been critical of those on here too.
Ukraine has strong support across the globe and here on HN. It may be helpful if you to remember we are approaching the US midterms (among others), winter is coming to Ukraine with more Russian bombs than snow, and we seeing increased Russian propaganda and misinformation campaigns (over time). When you make statements that mirror theirs - you will get pushback, resentment, and hostility.
I get exposed to far more western propaganda here, mate. Russia Today is banned (at least on TV.) NATO all the way. One of my best friends watches this stuff most of the day. There is plenty of misinformation in there too... Like that the war is about to end. I've been hearing that for at least four or five years, but it's ground on every since. (I'm sure Moscow puts out similar crap "victory is ours" etc.) Except it hasn't.
The real beneficiaries here are arms dealers and military leaders. They're doing a roaring trade while thousands of people die. War makes money. There are obviously some people benefitting from this attrition otherwise it would have gone to proper talks and negotiations.
I don't have any interest in American mid terms. Only two parties are allowed to win. We're not all Americans in this world (or Russian spies, extraterrestrials in meat suits or active Freemasons.)
Our politicians and western media sources repeat Russian propaganda. It's all over social media. Everyone is exposed to it. I don't doubt American propaganda is wide spread across the world as well, but American propaganda is in part repeated Russian propaganda (like our current administration is fond of doing). There are even accusations / possible whistleblowing that it is actually the US Military masquerading as Russian propaganda and misinformation spreaders.
https://www.kenklippenstein.com/p/how-the-military-will-hack...
I'm trying to less divide the world by country or similar, and divide it more by Oligarchy and The People. The vast majority of us have the same needs, dreams, and desires. The Oligarchy and media (they largely control) seek to divide us.
You seem intent on being argumentative, in considering your collection of comments under this flagged post, so I'm checking out of this thread. I hope you do the same.
Based on your previous comments I have you tagged as: "anti Ukraine troll; in Scotland", so I don't think you posting this was an accident.
So you're ?Dutch and telling me how to speak English?
Two can play at this nonsense. You don't live far from Brussels do you, ya rocket? What is headquartered there? (Clue: I'm not referring to the European Union.)
Guess what? I support Ukrainian and Irish independence, just like I support Scottish, Catalan, Tibetan and the independence of currently stateless nations. I think the break up of the USSR was a good thing but that many of its successor governments are corrupt.
I guess you didn't spot that at your desk in Brussels.
No idea what "ninja editing" is, but perhaps you know what "snitch jacketing" is? That's when you start making insinuations about people because you disagree with them. Almost as pathetic as accusing them of being bots.
"Ninja editing" is when you post something here, then come back (within the two hour edit window) and change what it says, without marking it "[Edit: <changes here>]" or something similar.
Who cares? Well, if someone is trying to reply to you, you can make their reply look like a lie or off topic (whether deliberately or not).
This gives you a problem if you decide that you overstated your case, or that you were too harsh. Do you edit in a way that removes what you said that was too harsh or too strong, or do you leave it, thereby leaving what is going to trigger hostile responses? The best way to do it might be to remove it, and add "[Edit: Removed inflammatory language.]" or something similar.
"The Ukraine" is normal Russian-English
Ukraine is a country and people, the rest of use would appreciate you updating how you refer to them.
Timothy Miller is a good source to learn about Ukraine - the people, country, culture, and history.
No, it's normal in English. Here is a BBC link about it ffs:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18233844
"Yet the English-speaking media can't quite agree on how one of the two co-hosts should be described. It is "the Ukraine" in the UK's Daily Mirror, external, and simply "Ukraine" in the Times of India, external. Why the confusion?"
It goes on to say that the Ukrainian government doesn't like it. But since neither Ukrainian nor Russian use definite articles, it makes no odds and is not offensive.
I still say "the Czech Republic" or "the Basque Country". (I don't say "Czechia".) I know people who used to talk about "the Argentine". Apparently a Dutch person (if he is Dutch) seems to think I can't speak English.
That's a pretty selective quote, the article actually goes in to this in much further detail, which you conveniently left out:
"The Ukraine" is incorrect both grammatically and politically, says Oksana Kyzyma of the Embassy of Ukraine in London.
"Ukraine is both the conventional short and long name of the country," she says. "This name is stated in the Ukrainian Declaration of Independence and Constitution."
The use of the article relates to the time before independence in 1991, when Ukraine was a republic of the Soviet Union known as the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic, she says. Since then, it should be merely Ukraine.
There is no definite article in the Ukrainian or Russian languages and there is another theory why it crept into the English language.
Those who called it "the Ukraine" in English must have known that the word meant "borderland", says Anatoly Liberman, a professor at the University of Minnesota with a specialism in etymology. So they referred to it as "the borderland".
"After the collapse of the Soviet Union, Ukrainians probably decided that the article denigrated their country [by identifying it as a part of Russia] and abolished 'the' while speaking English, so now it is simply Ukraine.
"That's why the Ukraine suddenly lost its article in the last 20 years, it's a sort of linguistic independence in Europe, it's hugely symbolic."
--
"That's a pretty selective quote, the article actually goes in to this in much further detail, which you conveniently left out"
Which I mentioned, if you bothered to read it or not. But since you like making false accusations about people and playing mind games, you decided to ignore that. (You use the exact same tactic elsewhere.)
Since neither Ukrainian nor Russian use articles, it is all moot. It is not an issue. We talk about "the Borders" (a region here), "the Highlands" etc in Scotland and that has nothing at all to do with which way we think this country should go.
There was a seventies football song here, "We're on the march wi' Ally's Army/ We're going tae the Argentine"
According to your logic that means that saying "the Argentine" means that it is "identifying it as part of the Spanish Empire". How about "the USA"? Does that definite article mean that it should be ruled from London? Or the United Arab Emirates?
What about "the Netherlands"? The Dutch have been ruled by three empires I can think of. That argument holds no water.
It is a non-issue which some Dutch rando decides to bring up.. Oh that was you wasn't it?
I hope your "job" pays you well.
sounds like more than just you need to update how they refer to other humans and cultures, it's not hard to be respectful to them... over your arguing here
"The Ukraine" is not disrespectful to begin with.
Try looking at Romance languages, they attach articles to many countries and that is not disrespectful either. Celtic languages do it too. Are you going to complain about that?
Most Slavic languages do not have articles.
Do you or your friends refer to the UK as England? I bet you do. That's worse.
I use both and will try to be better, will you commit to the same?
Türkiye is the hardest one for me I am currently aware of, because of the umlaut and typing
https://turkiye.un.org/en/184798-turkeys-name-changed-t%C3%B...
---
What I think we are doing here is Chapter 16 in Timothy Miller's book On Tyranny
16. Learn from peers in other countries
Keep up your friendships abroad, or make new friends in other countries. The present difficulties in the United States are an element of a larger trend. And no country is going to find a solution by itself. Make sure you and your family have passports.
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