The worst part is in the end: “We will also give the police the powers they need to keep pace with criminal use of emerging technologies in order to keep our children safe.”
Which means that not only will it blur it, it will also report it and you will be processed for a picture of your kid for the doctor or when the "fail safe" software fails.
Honestly, doctors need training about what they should or should not ask parents for. When my daughter was a month old her GP asked me to take photos of her diaper rash and email them in. "Uh no, not going to do that."
Is the concern the doctor, or someone in their office misusing the pictures? Or is it the fear of having such an image on your phone or sent over the internet at all? Or is the concern that the very concept of such an image being recorded is morally wrong? Or is it something else?
Real question, why not? It seems like a reasonable request barring needing to go into the office. My comms and images with our pediatricians are through their app which they constantly remind us is under strict HIPAA compliance.
They should be able to ask for that in a secure manner with security and retention controls and guardrails for how that data is accessed. In other words, email is not ideal.
Or, if your time and money allows it, deny that option and take your kid into the doctor in person.
We both know that if it's not built in straight away, it will be upgraded to report you without even notifying you of the fact. Exactly how the Apple csam detection system was supposed to work before apple backed off - if a picture was deemed csam your phone would automatically report you without telling you about it.
> there was a “ghastly worldwide industry” of child sexual abuse material being created, and that Britain was one of the biggest consumers of it,
They're talking about anime and how UK is not making any, nor is it significant market of to be infliential to, yet nevertheless consuming it in ever larger quantity over the years, unilaterally receiving cultural influence with no leverages, not even cash flow that can be choked off. Lots of these "CSAM" stuff is inflated with imaginary kids and trafficking angles to hide that intent, but it boils down to that.
Otherwise the action taken would be to assigning more police officers or otherwise assigning more resources to support kids IRL. They're not doing that. They only want speeches suppressed.
I don't know why they don't just tax social media for it, though. CDN bandwidth for foreign user-generated contents can be measured. Maybe because they just don't like fictions at all, but that ship had sailed like, thousands of years ago.
>>Otherwise the action taken would be to assigning more police officers or otherwise assigning more resources to support kids IRL. They're not doing that. They only want speeches suppressed.
My county went from 56 youth support officers to just 2 in the last few years. But yes, government(s) that cares about children /s
Interesting. The first laws in Turkey started to around 15 years ago with the only purpose of protecting children. That is how the first internet blocking started in Turkey. Now they block any negative thing about the government. But CSAM is not active in Turkey because why would it be? It is not about children but opressing political opponents.
At this point why they don’t record everything from our microphones? It will prevent many tax evasions and crimes.
The hereditaries were far more civil libertarian than the political appointees that now make up the whole HoL, and would have almost certainly been against this.
An 'old phone amnesty', where you take all your old phones to the police station on a given day. Anyone still in possession of one after that date gets prosecuted, like they would for having an unlicensed gun.
"Older devices could also be covered using a mandatory software update." So your already slow device will get a forced update to now make it compliant.
The house of lords should absolutely fuck off back to the dark ages where it belongs. Useless institution that keeps interfering with democracy(case in point - recent assisted dying bill)
The UK is running so fast towards ever increasing authoritarianism. I can't see it stopping.
They were pushing out today that they're going to add, well, what they call a ban for under 16s, which really means strong ID for everyone else, to access eBay and Vinted in case kids use the messaging functions on them.
It'll be TCP next. Then you'll need government permission to blink.
This will create more attack vectors, make phones more ineffeciant, make massive piles of people innocent of wrongdoing put prosecuted and jailed for sending pics of their kids to their family and doctors, and generally increase the power of the state to surveil its citizens to an extreme degree, on par with the worst totalitarian dictatorships.
Its funny, every time I talk to a brit they seem very intelligent and reasonable but then they've been happily electing people who make their country into an extreme surveillance state, labor & conservative both. I think their accent just makes them sound smarter than they are.
Every time i talk to a brit around these things it just ends up with a: "well they can decrypt it in ~10 years anyway so why try... These are people in IT, people that works with security and networking just giving up directly.
I've lived here for over 16 years now, and if I had to sum up Brits in one word it would be "apathy" - there's no point in fighting for anything because nothing ever gets better. Friends will admit in private conversations that they are concerned about surveillance but they aren't going to voice this anywhere because there's no point and it probably won't even affect them so why bother. There is a small group of people who still believe in protesting, but after several people were sentenced to 5 years(!!!) in prison for planning(!!!!) a protest, that had a chilling effect on various organisations around the country. Not to mention the entire farce that is aggressive criminalisation of anyone who even dares to mention Palestine Action around any kind of protest.
For what it's worth, I can not tell if you earnestly mean what you are saying, or if it is rhetoric with the implication "This is worth fussing over, and this will be used in the near future to scan for content other than CSAM".
I'd give it a few months before they scan every photo/video you ever take for other purposes. If you were at the wrong public gathering, I don't know if they'll even bother with parallel construction.
Pretty sure the current proposal will already require scanning everything.
To stop the “production” you would need real time scanning of the camera when taking pictures and video and disable the ability to save if csam is detected.
More likely they'll collect from phone manufacturers the IMEI of all devices which are updated, and then send police in to confiscate any device which is powered up and connects to a mobile network when not updated.
How many of them still have Ghislane on there speed dial? and palsy walsy pics of themselves, the prince formerly known as royal, Jeffery, and a few junior massage trainies.
doubful this will pass in its current form, but if it somehow does: countdown until yet another parent is arrested for pictures of their own baby in their phone.
The worst part is in the end: “We will also give the police the powers they need to keep pace with criminal use of emerging technologies in order to keep our children safe.”
Which means that not only will it blur it, it will also report it and you will be processed for a picture of your kid for the doctor or when the "fail safe" software fails.
I can't help but think of the dad who was investigated by the FBI for having pictures he took to show his kid's doctor.
Are parents going to be arrested for pictures of their kids in the bathtub? Or at least are they going to be blurred?
Honestly, doctors need training about what they should or should not ask parents for. When my daughter was a month old her GP asked me to take photos of her diaper rash and email them in. "Uh no, not going to do that."
Is the concern the doctor, or someone in their office misusing the pictures? Or is it the fear of having such an image on your phone or sent over the internet at all? Or is the concern that the very concept of such an image being recorded is morally wrong? Or is it something else?
Real question, why not? It seems like a reasonable request barring needing to go into the office. My comms and images with our pediatricians are through their app which they constantly remind us is under strict HIPAA compliance.
No, we should instead stop sexualing children. And we should ban this kind of mass surveillance.
They should be able to ask for that in a secure manner with security and retention controls and guardrails for how that data is accessed. In other words, email is not ideal.
Or, if your time and money allows it, deny that option and take your kid into the doctor in person.
Probably. The government just made couples who record face sitting, without distributing, for their own use, sex offenders.
edit: But we live in a country where everything is illegal but rarely anyone is arrested for it so that's somehow ok /s
> Are parents going to be arrested for pictures of their kids in the bathtub?
No. Because this magical new software will prevent such pictures.
We both know that if it's not built in straight away, it will be upgraded to report you without even notifying you of the fact. Exactly how the Apple csam detection system was supposed to work before apple backed off - if a picture was deemed csam your phone would automatically report you without telling you about it.
> there was a “ghastly worldwide industry” of child sexual abuse material being created, and that Britain was one of the biggest consumers of it,
They're talking about anime and how UK is not making any, nor is it significant market of to be infliential to, yet nevertheless consuming it in ever larger quantity over the years, unilaterally receiving cultural influence with no leverages, not even cash flow that can be choked off. Lots of these "CSAM" stuff is inflated with imaginary kids and trafficking angles to hide that intent, but it boils down to that.
Otherwise the action taken would be to assigning more police officers or otherwise assigning more resources to support kids IRL. They're not doing that. They only want speeches suppressed.
I don't know why they don't just tax social media for it, though. CDN bandwidth for foreign user-generated contents can be measured. Maybe because they just don't like fictions at all, but that ship had sailed like, thousands of years ago.
>>Otherwise the action taken would be to assigning more police officers or otherwise assigning more resources to support kids IRL. They're not doing that. They only want speeches suppressed.
My county went from 56 youth support officers to just 2 in the last few years. But yes, government(s) that cares about children /s
I think it's very interesting. The detection function needs to send data back to the cloud, right?
Does it need to be written into the Kernel? Or how does it work?
I think we're probably not far from the world of Watch Dogs. As for whether it will become 2077, we'll have to wait and see.
Good question. If so, we will be prevented from taking photos when offline. And will pay extra data charges when not.
I'm so happy they left the EU.
Interesting. The first laws in Turkey started to around 15 years ago with the only purpose of protecting children. That is how the first internet blocking started in Turkey. Now they block any negative thing about the government. But CSAM is not active in Turkey because why would it be? It is not about children but opressing political opponents.
At this point why they don’t record everything from our microphones? It will prevent many tax evasions and crimes.
Kind of an aside but they finally removed the hedetary members this year (yes this year)! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Lords_(Hereditary_Pee...
Though there's still these lads I think? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lords_Spiritual
The hereditaries were far more civil libertarian than the political appointees that now make up the whole HoL, and would have almost certainly been against this.
Hereditary?
Hereditary members of the House of Lords
He was asking about your original spelling.
Yea nah.
How do they plan on stopping creation, especially on older devices?
Or on non-UK devices. This just inflates values in the UK of such devices and contents that UK will be unable to create, let alone compete with.
An 'old phone amnesty', where you take all your old phones to the police station on a given day. Anyone still in possession of one after that date gets prosecuted, like they would for having an unlicensed gun.
"Older devices could also be covered using a mandatory software update." So your already slow device will get a forced update to now make it compliant.
The house of lords should absolutely fuck off back to the dark ages where it belongs. Useless institution that keeps interfering with democracy(case in point - recent assisted dying bill)
This is not about CSAM, it is about an infrastructure for large scale censorship and tracking of publishing and publishers.
Anyone talking about CSAM has missed the point entirely.
Yep.
The ‘won’t somebody think of the children’ argument that already got IDing everyone online through as a social media age gate.
Bold move from a country that wrongfully arrested and convicted thousands of postmasters due to buggy software that determined they were stealing.
Don't forget the 13 who committed suicide. :(
The UK is running so fast towards ever increasing authoritarianism. I can't see it stopping.
They were pushing out today that they're going to add, well, what they call a ban for under 16s, which really means strong ID for everyone else, to access eBay and Vinted in case kids use the messaging functions on them.
It'll be TCP next. Then you'll need government permission to blink.
The HoL have put forward no manifesto and have zero democratic mandate, so they should be proposing jack shit.
This will create more attack vectors, make phones more ineffeciant, make massive piles of people innocent of wrongdoing put prosecuted and jailed for sending pics of their kids to their family and doctors, and generally increase the power of the state to surveil its citizens to an extreme degree, on par with the worst totalitarian dictatorships.
Its funny, every time I talk to a brit they seem very intelligent and reasonable but then they've been happily electing people who make their country into an extreme surveillance state, labor & conservative both. I think their accent just makes them sound smarter than they are.
Every time i talk to a brit around these things it just ends up with a: "well they can decrypt it in ~10 years anyway so why try... These are people in IT, people that works with security and networking just giving up directly.
I've lived here for over 16 years now, and if I had to sum up Brits in one word it would be "apathy" - there's no point in fighting for anything because nothing ever gets better. Friends will admit in private conversations that they are concerned about surveillance but they aren't going to voice this anywhere because there's no point and it probably won't even affect them so why bother. There is a small group of people who still believe in protesting, but after several people were sentenced to 5 years(!!!) in prison for planning(!!!!) a protest, that had a chilling effect on various organisations around the country. Not to mention the entire farce that is aggressive criminalisation of anyone who even dares to mention Palestine Action around any kind of protest.
I don't get the fuss. This is absolutely only going to be used to detect CSAM content, this year.
For what it's worth, I can not tell if you earnestly mean what you are saying, or if it is rhetoric with the implication "This is worth fussing over, and this will be used in the near future to scan for content other than CSAM".
I'd give it a few months before they scan every photo/video you ever take for other purposes. If you were at the wrong public gathering, I don't know if they'll even bother with parallel construction.
Pretty sure the current proposal will already require scanning everything.
To stop the “production” you would need real time scanning of the camera when taking pictures and video and disable the ability to save if csam is detected.
Very appropriate use of British understated sarcasm. Philomena Cunk would approve.
As usual, the UK seems to be driving towards 1984-style dystopia.
What could possibly go wrong with a government having the ability to stop people from seeing things that they consider bad.
[delayed]
UK's got a Mumsnet Government
Cool, so 800 tech illiterate senior citizens are mandating updates for _all_ legacy smartphones.
> Older devices could also be covered using a mandatory software update.
Highly curious about how they'll be able to do that.
Will they force apple to release ios27 for an iPhone 4?
More likely they'll collect from phone manufacturers the IMEI of all devices which are updated, and then send police in to confiscate any device which is powered up and connects to a mobile network when not updated.
How many of them still have Ghislane on there speed dial? and palsy walsy pics of themselves, the prince formerly known as royal, Jeffery, and a few junior massage trainies.
Have they tried investigating the Epstein Class?
doubful this will pass in its current form, but if it somehow does: countdown until yet another parent is arrested for pictures of their own baby in their phone.
Maybe they should focus on fixing their country first