FM-1 is an interesting case study. From what I understand, M-Vave saw what the community was doing with their device, and decided to go along with the flow by releasing an official SDK and a new "open" groovebox firmware, in addition to this Workbench tool.
Right now, designing and mass-producing hardware is still a bit specialized, but creating software isn't. They have decided to embrace life as a creative hardware platform.
Our algorithms must all be feeding us the same things, I was about to buy one of these yesterday. I've been excited by the various Groovebox firmwares in particular.
I play music by sight (poorly) and can improvise a little bit on guitar, and would love to understand music theory better but so far do not.
Is this a useful device to get a feel for creating music, or is it only really useful if you already understand music theory or improvisation?
I have an FM-1, and it's definitely a fun device for the price and worth having just to putz around while sitting on the couch. However, I don't think it's the easiest way to get started creating music. I personally have gotten much more value out of a DAW like FL Studio. I've tried to go DAWless (groove boxes, samplers, trackers, etc), but I always end up back in FL Studio.
If the OP is a software developer it's actually helpful to download a custom firmware's source code and have an LLM teach you how to use the firmware to play music and learn music theory at the same time, on one of the groove boxes.
E.g. it'll tell you how to activate the arpeggiator, as well as what an arpeggio is, what notes comprise each chord, scales, etc, which are all programmed into the firmware.
Grooveboxes can't really do anything that you haven't been able to do for 15 years with internet resources and pirated FL Studio (other DAWs are available). The main value is having a break from the computer & physical knobs to twiddle. If you value time away from the computer, something like Korg M01[D] on the [3]DS might be worth trying since you can't spend hours tweaking synth parameters (and I imagine it's much easier to sequence on).
I haven't used an FM-1, so I can't speak to the specifics of it, but you absolutely do not need to understand music theory and improvisation to make music on something like this.
Additionally, understanding theory and improvisation is certainly a great thing to know if you're trying to make music, but you can understand a ton of things in the abstract and also be pretty terrible at applying it in the moment.
So if you want to get a device you can throw some hacked firmware on and have some fun, I'd say don't let your lack of theory hold you back.
> Is this a useful device to get a feel for creating music, or is it only really useful if you already understand music theory or improvisation?
"Useful" is a really subjective word when it comes to making music in general. Some template groove on a shit keyboard could be the base for a hit song (like Gorillaz' Clint Eastwood) while others don't make stuff unless in front of a modular synth with 100% control of everything.
Any instrument can be fun without knowing music theory, as long as you're willing to trial and error for a bit, until you find what sounds good :)
It was rare pre-LLMs, post-LLM seems more and more go this way actually. Just few hours I wrote this in a comment about established brands embracing the new user-firmware world:
My personal guess (and hope I suppose) is that all of them go in this direction cough Elektron cough, which judging by the current wave, doesn't seem impossible.
My first FM-1 is out for delivery. I once assisted in a 2" tape studio, I have played with many synths, and yet I am so excited for this little thing.
This is such a cool hardware meme/software/ai dev thing that makes me very happy for the world.
I am just about to start learning. If anyone could drop firmware knowledge aside from Baud Girl (cool af) ... I would appreciate it. I am mostly excited about Obervave, but I will have two FM-1's shortly... what is the best step sequencer firmware at the moment?
They will also be releasing a FM-2 (a slightly larger version but details are slim) later this year. No details on pricing either but assume it will be priced in similar respects to the FM-1 (little bit more for a little bit extra stuff)
Downsides immediately jump out at me, it lacks real DIN MIDI ports, having those irritating 1/8" jacks instead which require an adapter. Built in battery, hopefully not too difficult to replace. I vastly prefer AAs for this use case like the Volcas use. It has a fan, that's not good at all. It looks cheap (look at the bottom photo here https://www.m-vave.com/product?id=fm-1) and not sturdy. Similar to my Elektron Moden Cycles and my Polyend Tracker, a bit flimsy and cheap.
I feel like the Chinese have made and sold enough music gear on behalf of other manufacturers over time that they can technically make the products, but I don't think they understand the market so they will be flawed and toy-grade for a while until they hire some consultants and carefully study the various portable MIDI gear that has succeeded over time. I'm not sure what the electronic music scene looks like in China but I would suspect most of the people involved still use non-Chinese gear and software.
You are criticizing a piece of equipment that created a minor revolution in the music market. Think about that. Sure it has flaws, but it brought vibe music firmware to the masses.
It looks cheap because it is cheap—something like $60 US. As for understanding the market, they appear to be doing an okay job of it; lots of people are buying three or more of these.
This thing is absolutely worth the $$$ once you install Sloop on it but I regret having bought one only because I'm getting way more mileage out of using a small game pad to drive the iOS port of Dirtywave M8 (and am probably going to buy a hardware unit when they restock). Personally I enjoy the tracker workflow and chopping samples infinitely more than doing the sequencer thing on a tiny screen but I can't argue that this unit is very powerful for how cheap it is.
I bought a Polyend Tracker and it also has a toy-grade build. I love the instrument itself, they just open-sourced the whole software stack as it's going discontinued. But the device itself is cheap and the rubbery coating on the top panel is already starting to wear under the knob where I rest my hand. I want to build a custom enclosure that has a tilted screen, real MIDI ports, and a wooden top with a palm rest when the plastic eventually gives out or gets too gross, quite a few people have done custom enclosures even with internal batteries already.
But yeah the cheapness is an issue. Even older entry-grade gear, while often entirely plastic, is much more robust and with real ports, they often have one of those little plastic rakes that retains your power cable too. A three cent addition I'm sure but one which is great to have.
I already have some groove boxes, what does this one bring to the table? Every groove box is annoying in its own way even the really good ones. I have yet to find something that does it all better than the good old MPC. I need a MIDI event list editor, very very few grooveboxes offer this. Only Emu/Ensoniq, Akai and Yamaha's did. Akai still offers it but I don't think their newer mini-MPC has this.
No comment on the general criticisms, but jacks for MIDI is unfair, I think. I probably get more annoyed at connecting DIN MIDI with the mix of equipment I’ve got since most of it uses jacks, not DINs, especially the things I’d connect to a M-Vave. I’m resisting the temptation to buy one right now.
It's not unfair. Looking at my home studio here I have nine different MIDI synths all set up, two require adapters, and for some reason one set of these sets of identical-looking adapters doesn't even work properly on one of my synths that needs 'em. The other takes both, one only likes one pair. It's a huge pain in the ass. Other issue is they come out easily, DIN has a very solid connection and it takes quite some force to remove the connector. Also I'm not entirely sure how good the isolation is on those little 1/8" jacks, proper DIN MIDI connectors are all opto-isolated so you don't get ground loops.
The ass part about jacks is that there is apparently 2 standards for midi over jack, with various gear manufacturers split over which one to use. You can make device accept either but it's pretty rare sight.
There are actually 4 ways manufacturers do it. Something like the Disaster Area Designs[1] MIDI Box is a necessity once you start dealing with guitar effects pedals.
Feels like studio setups are personal and individual enough that you can't say it's fair or unfair for someone else to care about specific features. Everything I own, including my own modular synth, has MIDI DIN ports on them, so I too look for that in new gear, but friend of mine too don't use MIDI for anything, obviously he doesn't look for that :)
USB MIDI seems tempting, you can send a giant virtual MIDI cable snake down one wire, but the connector issue rears its head again. It'd be cool if there was a more robust standard for USB connectors. I bet industry, the military, scientists, professional audio people etc. would all love such a thing.
That's a relief. The only thing I have in my studio with a fan is my ancient Roland Virtual Studio which I love and which still can not be replaced by anything newer because of the lack of full MIDI control over all features.
Yes, it's all software, and FM synthesis is using the same engine as dexed. It's a Blackfin chip, which has pretty good throughput for DSP (digital signal processing). A ton more detail is at [1], including the operating system, which is a FreeRTOS-derived SMP kernel.
I got one for my kid's obsessed with music composition. What would you use this with so they can compose multitrack tunes, something like Chrome Music Lab or Beepbox? Anything in Android so they can compose on the go, such on an aeroplane?
FM-1 is really nice because it's basically a platform with Bluetooth, WiFi, screen, speaker, audio out, usb, rechargeable battery, knobs and buttons in ready to use package. You can build anything with it (considering small CPU and ram).
It seems they also have the SMK-37, which is not that much more expensive, but has actual keys so probably more useful for actually playing music, and apparently most alternative firmware support it too.
What is the right way of thinking about frequency modulation for musicians? I know some of the maths but I can't operate the bitwig FM-4 synth. Do you just screw around with the thing until you can operate it?
I find it essential to have a MIDI CC knob box of some kind with FM. My MPC works in this capacity, I also bought an external one. Most FM synths support a huge number of MIDI CCs and FM really comes alive if you twiddle with the knobs during patch design, same as with other synths.
This link is a great practical guide, which has you look at waveforms in an audio editor and clone them using FM, one operator at a time. He walks you through making clones of several real life instruments, 6 operators is enough to sound quite good and 8 is even better. FM has a reputation for being computer-y sounding but it doesn't need to be. A lot of that is just baggage from default patches introduced decades ago with that fresh '80s sound, those patches from the DX-7 are still on the newest Yamaha flagship workstations. And as everybody knows the grand majority of sounds you hear in music are barely- or not-tweaked presets.
I'm surprised there isn't a sturdy generic VST-runner box with an interface to configure the MIDI in / out and which VSTs will run. A sort of headless generic synth. My Roland VariOS synth from ages ago which I got for like $50 works like this, you use a WIN32 or Classic Mac computer to load and configure the various synths (it has a couple emulators or workalikes for older synths, plus a crazy synth that chops up and munges incoming audio under MIDI control) and then you only need to power the 1U rack mounted module unless you're designing patches, in which case you have to attach a computer.
You can pick them up, often fully loaded with plugins, for a few hundred dollars. I wrote parts of the system. They were running Linux and fun to hack on.
I currently work in the professional audio industry and know of a few modern efforts underway to produce modern version of this, but I am not convinced there is market for such a device anymore.
That's a really cool. It doesn't look overly-complicated, just perfect actually. I might keep my eyes peeled for one of these things, I love scrounging around for old MIDI gear. Used to be a lot cheaper than it is these days, ironically. Build quality on most everything was top notch too.
I'm sure a lot of professional musicians would probably prefer to use something less fragile than a laptop, something you can rack up, with no pesky desktop OS niggles to worry about during a show. As you know many instruments today are simply dedicated VST runners with a handy physical interface, see Roland's Boutique and Aira synths. I have an MPC One which I love, it can run proprietary VSTs. Maybe such convergences have killed the need for a dedicated box.
They are super cool! Look on Reverb. As I said, you sometimes end up with some fully licensed, expensive plugins as well. A lot of us can probably survive being a couple of versions behind.
I know for a fact new devices like this are on the horizon, but it just might not be the form factor that you are looking for.
For me the main issue is the VST-as-a-service model which is already taking over. I don't sub or micro-transact. The Roland VariOS thing I have had very expensive instruments too, luckily mine came with the CF card with all the ones which exist. I've never hooked my MPC up to the Internet to get VSTs either, I'm quite happy with what I have actually. I have been fiddling with electronic music for a long long time, and I remember when VSTs hit the scene, I got VST-itis and must have pirated everything under the sun but that leads to choice paralysis (same as getting all the MAME ROMs back in the day). Now I'm happier getting more out of what I have by using my brain a bit. Having generic USB MIDI on the MPC has been amazing though, everything is so much tighter without having to daisy-chain and even Roger Linn is impressed by how tight the timing is. 9 ins and outs is incredible, if I need more I just attach another generic USB MIDI interface.
It's actually a golden age for the MIDI fan but there's a lot of complaining to be done too about aspects of it. Cheapness and hooking you to a store being two big ones.
This device is really cool. Started to get into music production with a dawless setup and with an FM-1 you can use DX7 patches and with some firmware choices you can turn a $50 machine into a groove box.
Think this bodes well for the future of Chinese consumer electronics. They have really been punching above their weight. Even the "cheap" guitar pedals are better than what you'd find with American/EU equivalent companies while being 60-80% cheaper.
Just a shame that Chinese workers are too often exploited.
In terms of guitars, you can actually get better guitars for substantially cheaper from China. Should I pay more for less quality? Being "Made in USA" used to mean quality, but it doesn't anymore
You do understand that costs of making something in the West is different than in China? Some companies unfortunately have to compromise on quality to maintain price that is not outrageous when you compare to Chinese.
FM-1 is an interesting case study. From what I understand, M-Vave saw what the community was doing with their device, and decided to go along with the flow by releasing an official SDK and a new "open" groovebox firmware, in addition to this Workbench tool.
Right now, designing and mass-producing hardware is still a bit specialized, but creating software isn't. They have decided to embrace life as a creative hardware platform.
I think that's what happened, but follow-up.. if one orders an exact FM-1 Alibaba, does the China-based company M-Vave make any money from the sale?
It's been a great little toy, I install a new firmware every couple of days. I especially enjoy the various generative firmwares.
Many of them work in browser too, which is essential for choosing what to try next!
Some faves:
NACHTFART: https://fartypants.github.io/fm1-nachtfahrt/emu/
DUB-1: https://sbegueria.github.io/fm1-dub/emu/
Our algorithms must all be feeding us the same things, I was about to buy one of these yesterday. I've been excited by the various Groovebox firmwares in particular.
I play music by sight (poorly) and can improvise a little bit on guitar, and would love to understand music theory better but so far do not.
Is this a useful device to get a feel for creating music, or is it only really useful if you already understand music theory or improvisation?
I have an FM-1, and it's definitely a fun device for the price and worth having just to putz around while sitting on the couch. However, I don't think it's the easiest way to get started creating music. I personally have gotten much more value out of a DAW like FL Studio. I've tried to go DAWless (groove boxes, samplers, trackers, etc), but I always end up back in FL Studio.
If the OP is a software developer it's actually helpful to download a custom firmware's source code and have an LLM teach you how to use the firmware to play music and learn music theory at the same time, on one of the groove boxes.
E.g. it'll tell you how to activate the arpeggiator, as well as what an arpeggio is, what notes comprise each chord, scales, etc, which are all programmed into the firmware.
Grooveboxes can't really do anything that you haven't been able to do for 15 years with internet resources and pirated FL Studio (other DAWs are available). The main value is having a break from the computer & physical knobs to twiddle. If you value time away from the computer, something like Korg M01[D] on the [3]DS might be worth trying since you can't spend hours tweaking synth parameters (and I imagine it's much easier to sequence on).
It's all over YouTube for me too. The firmware hacking for this thing has got people hyped.
https://thefirmwarehub.com/
This looks great.
How long until we get that with a native support for changing firmware?
As in: preload ten firmware versions and switch between them, with persisted state?
not enough space on device
but hook your FM1 to your phone and flash from there (the firmware hub)... very portable.
i like m-pyre a lot right now - https://historyofsky.github.io/m-pyre/
I haven't used an FM-1, so I can't speak to the specifics of it, but you absolutely do not need to understand music theory and improvisation to make music on something like this.
Additionally, understanding theory and improvisation is certainly a great thing to know if you're trying to make music, but you can understand a ton of things in the abstract and also be pretty terrible at applying it in the moment.
So if you want to get a device you can throw some hacked firmware on and have some fun, I'd say don't let your lack of theory hold you back.
> Is this a useful device to get a feel for creating music, or is it only really useful if you already understand music theory or improvisation?
"Useful" is a really subjective word when it comes to making music in general. Some template groove on a shit keyboard could be the base for a hit song (like Gorillaz' Clint Eastwood) while others don't make stuff unless in front of a modular synth with 100% control of everything.
Any instrument can be fun without knowing music theory, as long as you're willing to trial and error for a bit, until you find what sounds good :)
hello fellow youtube addict.
The explosion of firmwares for this device, and the manufacturers embrace thereof, is a rare bright spot in post-LLM music tech
> is a rare bright spot in post-LLM music tech
It was rare pre-LLMs, post-LLM seems more and more go this way actually. Just few hours I wrote this in a comment about established brands embracing the new user-firmware world:
> [...] Erica Synths (big in both desktop gear and modular synths), Polyend, Akai/MPC, Moog and more. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50482555
My personal guess (and hope I suppose) is that all of them go in this direction cough Elektron cough, which judging by the current wave, doesn't seem impossible.
My first FM-1 is out for delivery. I once assisted in a 2" tape studio, I have played with many synths, and yet I am so excited for this little thing.
This is such a cool hardware meme/software/ai dev thing that makes me very happy for the world.
I am just about to start learning. If anyone could drop firmware knowledge aside from Baud Girl (cool af) ... I would appreciate it. I am mostly excited about Obervave, but I will have two FM-1's shortly... what is the best step sequencer firmware at the moment?
I've found this to be a good resource for discovering fun custom firmwares!
https://thefirmwarehub.com/
I’ve tried a few, I liked Jiant’s workflow the best so far (I also tried sloop and skiff)
I just wish it had proper 909 & 303 emulation
I've used sloop for a groove box firmware. Pretty nifty, like it more than the other groove box firmwares.
They will also be releasing a FM-2 (a slightly larger version but details are slim) later this year. No details on pricing either but assume it will be priced in similar respects to the FM-1 (little bit more for a little bit extra stuff)
I'd like to see velocity sensitive/aftertouch keys on this.
Downsides immediately jump out at me, it lacks real DIN MIDI ports, having those irritating 1/8" jacks instead which require an adapter. Built in battery, hopefully not too difficult to replace. I vastly prefer AAs for this use case like the Volcas use. It has a fan, that's not good at all. It looks cheap (look at the bottom photo here https://www.m-vave.com/product?id=fm-1) and not sturdy. Similar to my Elektron Moden Cycles and my Polyend Tracker, a bit flimsy and cheap.
I feel like the Chinese have made and sold enough music gear on behalf of other manufacturers over time that they can technically make the products, but I don't think they understand the market so they will be flawed and toy-grade for a while until they hire some consultants and carefully study the various portable MIDI gear that has succeeded over time. I'm not sure what the electronic music scene looks like in China but I would suspect most of the people involved still use non-Chinese gear and software.
You are criticizing a piece of equipment that created a minor revolution in the music market. Think about that. Sure it has flaws, but it brought vibe music firmware to the masses.
It looks cheap because it is cheap—something like $60 US. As for understanding the market, they appear to be doing an okay job of it; lots of people are buying three or more of these.
> It looks cheap because it is cheap—something like $60 US
I just got one for $48 on aliexpress.
> toy-grade
This thing is absolutely worth the $$$ once you install Sloop on it but I regret having bought one only because I'm getting way more mileage out of using a small game pad to drive the iOS port of Dirtywave M8 (and am probably going to buy a hardware unit when they restock). Personally I enjoy the tracker workflow and chopping samples infinitely more than doing the sequencer thing on a tiny screen but I can't argue that this unit is very powerful for how cheap it is.
I bought a Polyend Tracker and it also has a toy-grade build. I love the instrument itself, they just open-sourced the whole software stack as it's going discontinued. But the device itself is cheap and the rubbery coating on the top panel is already starting to wear under the knob where I rest my hand. I want to build a custom enclosure that has a tilted screen, real MIDI ports, and a wooden top with a palm rest when the plastic eventually gives out or gets too gross, quite a few people have done custom enclosures even with internal batteries already.
But yeah the cheapness is an issue. Even older entry-grade gear, while often entirely plastic, is much more robust and with real ports, they often have one of those little plastic rakes that retains your power cable too. A three cent addition I'm sure but one which is great to have.
I already have some groove boxes, what does this one bring to the table? Every groove box is annoying in its own way even the really good ones. I have yet to find something that does it all better than the good old MPC. I need a MIDI event list editor, very very few grooveboxes offer this. Only Emu/Ensoniq, Akai and Yamaha's did. Akai still offers it but I don't think their newer mini-MPC has this.
No comment on the general criticisms, but jacks for MIDI is unfair, I think. I probably get more annoyed at connecting DIN MIDI with the mix of equipment I’ve got since most of it uses jacks, not DINs, especially the things I’d connect to a M-Vave. I’m resisting the temptation to buy one right now.
It's not unfair. Looking at my home studio here I have nine different MIDI synths all set up, two require adapters, and for some reason one set of these sets of identical-looking adapters doesn't even work properly on one of my synths that needs 'em. The other takes both, one only likes one pair. It's a huge pain in the ass. Other issue is they come out easily, DIN has a very solid connection and it takes quite some force to remove the connector. Also I'm not entirely sure how good the isolation is on those little 1/8" jacks, proper DIN MIDI connectors are all opto-isolated so you don't get ground loops.
The ass part about jacks is that there is apparently 2 standards for midi over jack, with various gear manufacturers split over which one to use. You can make device accept either but it's pretty rare sight.
Connector wise, far superior to DIN midi
There are actually 4 ways manufacturers do it. Something like the Disaster Area Designs[1] MIDI Box is a necessity once you start dealing with guitar effects pedals.
[1]: https://www.disasterareadesigns.com/shop/p/midi-box-4
> but jacks for MIDI is unfair, I think.
Feels like studio setups are personal and individual enough that you can't say it's fair or unfair for someone else to care about specific features. Everything I own, including my own modular synth, has MIDI DIN ports on them, so I too look for that in new gear, but friend of mine too don't use MIDI for anything, obviously he doesn't look for that :)
USB MIDI seems tempting, you can send a giant virtual MIDI cable snake down one wire, but the connector issue rears its head again. It'd be cool if there was a more robust standard for USB connectors. I bet industry, the military, scientists, professional audio people etc. would all love such a thing.
> but jacks for MIDI is unfair
not the person you're replying to, but -
I would be ok w/ the 1/8" jacks if there weren't TWO STANDARDS to keep up with. madness!
> It has a fan, that's not good at all.
I think that's actually the built-in speaker?
Correct, it does not have a fan
That's a relief. The only thing I have in my studio with a fan is my ancient Roland Virtual Studio which I love and which still can not be replaced by anything newer because of the lack of full MIDI control over all features.
Was just looking at this teardown https://www.reddit.com/r/synth/comments/1vgotkd/mvave_fm1_te...
I don't know anything about synthesisers, but would I be right in thinking the FM modulation would be done via software on the MCU?
Yes, it's all software, and FM synthesis is using the same engine as dexed. It's a Blackfin chip, which has pretty good throughput for DSP (digital signal processing). A ton more detail is at [1], including the operating system, which is a FreeRTOS-derived SMP kernel.
[1]: https://github.com/AL-255/FM-1-RE
This thing runs Linux and dexed (an open source dx7 player/emulator) - or any of the myriad vibecoded alt firmwares.
I got one for my kid's obsessed with music composition. What would you use this with so they can compose multitrack tunes, something like Chrome Music Lab or Beepbox? Anything in Android so they can compose on the go, such on an aeroplane?
There is multitrack firmware you can download for this, like Sloop.
https://thefirmwarehub.com/
currently watching this video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2puO1fV6Wi4
seems theres a few in there that make it more a DAW
I’ve found that hugeltons felucca is the way to go. The rest aren’t as good.
Koala Sampler is great for that.
FM-1 is really nice because it's basically a platform with Bluetooth, WiFi, screen, speaker, audio out, usb, rechargeable battery, knobs and buttons in ready to use package. You can build anything with it (considering small CPU and ram).
Is there Doom already ?
Of course :)
https://doom.deadlockinteractive.com/
Wouldn’t it be wonderful if when you clicked “about” on a website, it would tell you about the website .
What API does this use that isn't available in Firefox?
Judging from the "Connect Device" button in the upper right corner, probably WebMIDI.
It seems they also have the SMK-37, which is not that much more expensive, but has actual keys so probably more useful for actually playing music, and apparently most alternative firmware support it too.
You're generally better off with just getting separate MIDI keyboard if you want to use other gear too.
What is the right way of thinking about frequency modulation for musicians? I know some of the maths but I can't operate the bitwig FM-4 synth. Do you just screw around with the thing until you can operate it?
I find it essential to have a MIDI CC knob box of some kind with FM. My MPC works in this capacity, I also bought an external one. Most FM synths support a huge number of MIDI CCs and FM really comes alive if you twiddle with the knobs during patch design, same as with other synths.
This link is a great practical guide, which has you look at waveforms in an audio editor and clone them using FM, one operator at a time. He walks you through making clones of several real life instruments, 6 operators is enough to sound quite good and 8 is even better. FM has a reputation for being computer-y sounding but it doesn't need to be. A lot of that is just baggage from default patches introduced decades ago with that fresh '80s sound, those patches from the DX-7 are still on the newest Yamaha flagship workstations. And as everybody knows the grand majority of sounds you hear in music are barely- or not-tweaked presets.
https://csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~pbarfuss/FM_Synthesis_of_Real_I...
I recommend this video from mixed signals, it shows how a few commonly used and known fm sounds are made: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0S6NXIe_NyA
This is great! Thanks!
I find it fascinating. Basically people get ability to run AI made crap vst plugins in a calculator sized box and yet they go crazy about it.
I wonder how long this will last.
This also got companies like Behringer an idea that they can just release the hardware and people will create firmware for free. Genius.
edit: that reminds me I actually bought one too, but forgot about it. Still unopened.
I'm surprised there isn't a sturdy generic VST-runner box with an interface to configure the MIDI in / out and which VSTs will run. A sort of headless generic synth. My Roland VariOS synth from ages ago which I got for like $50 works like this, you use a WIN32 or Classic Mac computer to load and configure the various synths (it has a couple emulators or workalikes for older synths, plus a crazy synth that chops up and munges incoming audio under MIDI control) and then you only need to power the 1U rack mounted module unless you're designing patches, in which case you have to attach a computer.
Something like this but for VSTs would be killer.
There is/was; the Muse Research Receptor. It might be overly complex for what you are thinking of, but it existed.
https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/muse-research-receptor
https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/muse-research-receptor-...
You can pick them up, often fully loaded with plugins, for a few hundred dollars. I wrote parts of the system. They were running Linux and fun to hack on.
I currently work in the professional audio industry and know of a few modern efforts underway to produce modern version of this, but I am not convinced there is market for such a device anymore.
That's a really cool. It doesn't look overly-complicated, just perfect actually. I might keep my eyes peeled for one of these things, I love scrounging around for old MIDI gear. Used to be a lot cheaper than it is these days, ironically. Build quality on most everything was top notch too.
I'm sure a lot of professional musicians would probably prefer to use something less fragile than a laptop, something you can rack up, with no pesky desktop OS niggles to worry about during a show. As you know many instruments today are simply dedicated VST runners with a handy physical interface, see Roland's Boutique and Aira synths. I have an MPC One which I love, it can run proprietary VSTs. Maybe such convergences have killed the need for a dedicated box.
They are super cool! Look on Reverb. As I said, you sometimes end up with some fully licensed, expensive plugins as well. A lot of us can probably survive being a couple of versions behind.
I know for a fact new devices like this are on the horizon, but it just might not be the form factor that you are looking for.
For me the main issue is the VST-as-a-service model which is already taking over. I don't sub or micro-transact. The Roland VariOS thing I have had very expensive instruments too, luckily mine came with the CF card with all the ones which exist. I've never hooked my MPC up to the Internet to get VSTs either, I'm quite happy with what I have actually. I have been fiddling with electronic music for a long long time, and I remember when VSTs hit the scene, I got VST-itis and must have pirated everything under the sun but that leads to choice paralysis (same as getting all the MAME ROMs back in the day). Now I'm happier getting more out of what I have by using my brain a bit. Having generic USB MIDI on the MPC has been amazing though, everything is so much tighter without having to daisy-chain and even Roger Linn is impressed by how tight the timing is. 9 ins and outs is incredible, if I need more I just attach another generic USB MIDI interface.
It's actually a golden age for the MIDI fan but there's a lot of complaining to be done too about aspects of it. Cheapness and hooking you to a store being two big ones.
Completely off topic, but if you are a boomer with an iOS device, there are PLENTY of electronic music apps [and emulators] on that platform too.
PS: and I mean PLENTY !
This device is really cool. Started to get into music production with a dawless setup and with an FM-1 you can use DX7 patches and with some firmware choices you can turn a $50 machine into a groove box.
Think this bodes well for the future of Chinese consumer electronics. They have really been punching above their weight. Even the "cheap" guitar pedals are better than what you'd find with American/EU equivalent companies while being 60-80% cheaper.
Just a shame that Chinese workers are too often exploited.
In the EU/US there are different costs of living, running a business and standards for employment. That is reflected in the price.
But as long it is cheap and you'll never visit China, then who cares that someone might be exploited there.
In terms of guitars, you can actually get better guitars for substantially cheaper from China. Should I pay more for less quality? Being "Made in USA" used to mean quality, but it doesn't anymore
And?
You do understand that costs of making something in the West is different than in China? Some companies unfortunately have to compromise on quality to maintain price that is not outrageous when you compare to Chinese.
> In the EU/US there are different costs of living, running a business and standards for employment. That is reflected in the price.
...the price of made in china device that is just branded with EU/US brand ?
I was not talking about resellers. Sure you can commission product in China with your own branding. That is like buying from Temu with extra steps.
Is this an ad?